The Imprudent Freedom to Question Free Will


ask1.jpg

Good day Bro. Eli

I came across this article in one of the websites frequently visited by a lot of people and it caught my attention because of the words “free-will”. I know that scientists who claim that they are learned in their fields of expertise doubt the existence of God and believe in the evolution of man from apes. But I never thought that even the existence of “free-will” is also being questioned by these scientists.

I am posting this article on this blog site because I believe, with the help of God, if there is a person who can give a logical, biblical and sensible comment about this, it is you.

Anticipating your witty comment,

Godspeed, Bro. Eli!

alsie616

Dear Alsie616,

I do not know where you got the information that the scientist you are mentioning not only denies the existence of God, but the reality of free will, also. But as you wish, I will tackle this very important topic about human life.

Free will or, better still, free choice is something existent in some, but not all, creatures. Free will is something done without compulsion and willingness. The Encarta defines it as done voluntarily rather than by compulsion.

I believe that giving us free will is the most loving and compassionate act of the Creator. It is in our free will on what He prefers us to do , that He is delighted.

(Isaiah 1:19) “If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land…”

Although because of it also, we can do things that disgust Him; and will bring people to destruction.

(Deuteronomy 30:19) “I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live…”

The preceding verse gives us an insight that God wants us to use our free will or free choice in doing His will. He delights if we give generously according to our free will.

(2 Corinthians 9:6-7) “But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.”

But giving to delight God, must be coupled with good deeds.

(Hebrews 13:15-16) “Through him then let us continually offer up a sacrifice of praise to God, that is, the fruit of lips that acknowledge his name. Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.”

As I said earlier, some (but not all) were given free will by God. Angels have their own free will. This is proven by the fact that other angels chose to leave their own habitation and rebel against God. Most famous of them is satan.

(Jude 1:6) “And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.”

(Revelation 12:9) “And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.”

Even cherubim are portrayed in the Bible being evil because of improper use of free will.

(Ezekiel 28:14-17) “Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.”

The same thing is happening to man who are being led astray from the path of righteousness because of the abuse of their free will.

(Romans 3:12) “They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.”

And this is part of the history of mankind since time immemorial.

(Malachi 3:7) “Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return?”

Common sense and incidental happenings in our daily lives, proves the existence or the reality of free will in man. Anybody who will doubt this is a fool.

Here is a very simple example:

A. A man is being loved by two women B and C. He can freely choose from the two; but he chose B. Is it not free will?

B. In another case, he chooses both and made them both suffer at the end. Of course, suffering comes if you do something with your own free will which is against the will of God.

(1 Timothy 3:2) “A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach…”

These are all irrefutable evidences that there really is free will among men. To understand the deeper part of it, we can just look on our being as an individual. In our bodies, there are what science calls as muscles acting voluntarily and involuntarily. The heart is one of them. It beats and pumps blood throughout the body unceasingly throughout ones lifetime without the control of man himself; while voluntary muscles moves are controlled by the mind.

heartdiagram.gif

Cardiac Muscle

The muscle of your heart is also striped but it is involuntary. It is called cardiac muscle: cardiac means “of the heart”. Cardiac muscle contracts and relaxes automatically without you having to think about it. When you take exercise your heart beats faster and with a bigger volume. This increase in cardiac output (how fast the blood is pumped around your body) is produced by a hormone called adrenaline. The vagus nerve can make the heart go slower; this happens when you are sitting or lying down. (http://www.purchon.com/biology/muscles.htm)

So in our being, the presence of voluntary and involuntary actions will tell our common senses that on this earth, there are things that happen because of man’s free will , and they can either be against or in accordance with God’s will. But life on earth is not exactly the same in all living creatures. There are things that happen in lower forms of life which are evidently not in conformity with their own will. While the female peacock may choose its mate in a particular mating period, in captivity, an animal doesn’t have a choice.

We, humans, are the most abusive users of free will in the animal kingdom. The free will of a bird to fly, it does not use for its own destruction. But we have used our free will throughout the entire history of humanity for our self destruction.

(Revelation 18:11) “And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.”

Whatever explanation or scientific studies done with the fruit fly that you are mentioning, they will not in any manner fit to humans, because according to the Bible, we have a different kind of brain and understanding very much superior and more complex than any other lower forms of life.

(Job 35:11) “Who teacheth us more than the beasts of the earth, and maketh us wiser than the fowls of heaven?”

I hope you have learned a little from this.

 

May God Bless You.

bro-eli.jpg
EFS

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

68 thoughts on “The Imprudent Freedom to Question Free Will

  1. Some really believes we came from apes and i’m so sick and tired of hearing about there family’s…
    Bible and science never contradicts…
    If you want proff?…will you came at the right place…

  2. This is indeed enlightening. I just have a question… according to psychologist, the mind affects what people feels. Thus, they say that the seat of our emotions is really at the brain and not the heart. What does the bible say about the seat of our free will? Is it in the mind or our hearts?

  3. nothing escapes the truth written in the Bible, that we came not because of evolution. A fact that those foolish and wicked cannot understand.
    Because He is good and His loving kindness is everlasting
    He didn’t want to force anybody. He intend us to obey His will by our own choice.

    To God be the glory!

  4. Thanks be to God for all wisdom and understanding that He has given us through His messenger!

    To God be the glory!

  5. I loved the example A then continued to B. It shows something very interesting and biblical.

    Thanks be unto God always.

  6. Superb! Once again an additional Insight from a man whose wisdom is boundless. one can never anticipate the answer that will come out of Brother Eli. A supernal Erudition! Praise be God for everything!

  7. To Liloth

    you wrote: our seat of our emotions is really at the brain.

    Yes, that is true! Therefore the right way to say I love you is this: ” I love you with all my hypothalamus” not I love you with all my heart.

    See, just like in religion we were conditioned to believe in something but in essence what we beleive in is never the truth.

    Liloth, I love you with all my hypothalamus!

  8. Ooooops! i think this is another outstanding infos about “Man’s Freewill”… You know few months ago, i have watched “Spiderman Movie” (though it’s only fictional a fruit of man’s illusion.) there’s actually a scene or dialogue in that story w/c caught-up my attention,
    When Peter Parker (Spiderman) avenge against “Sandman” and asking him “WHY DID U KILL MY UNCLE”, Sandman replied and said “I HAVE NO CHOICE!”, but Spiderman answered quickly “WE ALWAYS HAVE A CHOICE!!!” thats the most striking line in that movie w/c keeps me thinkin and thinkin up to when i got home that day…keep asking if that’s biblical and i remember that verse also in the bible in (Deuteronomy 30:19) “I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live…”

    So to all visitors out there i will leave this questions to all of YOU…..
    Heaven or Hell?; Do good or evil? God Or Satan? so which is which???… its up to all of you (YOUR FREEWILL). 🙂

  9. Some people do not use the free will given to us by God. They still cling to their beliefs and traditions taught by men. They rather choose to live and die with it than to explore and learn new things….they were stubborn !

    Let’s use our free will in service and for the glory of God.

  10. this is so cool.. superb! I got to give it to “Tolits R” you are right about that.. as Peter Parker said,
    “Whatever comes in our way whatever battle raging inside us WE always have a Choice. Its the Choice who makes us WHO WE ARE, and WE can ALWAYS choose to do what’s right.”
    to choose life is to choose what is right.. Thank God for another article bro. Eli! hope to have more articles to come God Bless!!!

  11. I am totally amazed because I have never seen anybody who could explain eloquently spiritual and scientific issues without contradiction.

    I only started reading your blog by accident and I feel so lucky to learn so much from you.

    I hope its not too much to ask one question that my scientist friend and I have been discussing for the longest time about the age of Adam. He told me that probably during those times, the calendar days might have been shorter… that’s why people reaches a very ripe age of 900+. He told me it is impossible for Sarah, the wife of Abraham to have conceived at such late age. The only logical answer is that their calendar days are far shorter compared to our calendar today. People before thought they are already this old when in truth they are still much younger.

    Do you think this is possible? Thank you.

  12. biblical freewill??? can somebody explain these

    ROMANS 9:20-21
    But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, “Why have you made me like this?”
    Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

    ROMANS 9:16

    So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth.”[g] 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.

  13. To all:

    If a man has free will God cannot have fore-knowledge. This two things God’s foreknowledge and man’s free will seem to be incompatible.

    Am i correct? or I am not?

    Because what sort of God do we have who knows what we are doing and what we shall do, and still leaves it to our free choice to do whatever we like? And what sort of creatures must we be?

  14. Pingback: Top Posts « WordPress.com

  15. To shaman:

    How does the verses you cited disprove Biblical free will???

    Are you trying to imply that there’s no ‘Biblical’ free will because doing something not in accordance to God’s will reap negative effects? Well that’s stupid!

    First do you even know what free will means?

    free will
    1. free and independent choice; voluntary decision: You took on the responsibility of your own free will.
    2. Philosophy. the doctrine that the conduct of human beings expresses personal choice and is not simply determined by physical or divine forces.

    Peope aren’t forced to follow God. As a proof most people today doesn’t follow God(and it shows with all the immmorality in the world today). You follow Him in your own will. YOU have the power to choose!!! Isn’t that free will? The power to choose?!?!?! God doesn’t control people like robots.

    Heck if I wanted to I can just quit studying right about now and just throw my life away doing drugs. Do I have the power to do that??? Don’t I have the free will to do that??? Of course I DO. But I CHOOSE not to!!! I’d rather follow God. Why? Because I know the end result of follwing Him is good.

    Consider this simple analogy:

    A chocolate bar is on the table wrapped in paper that says “Do not eat poisonous”.

    Do you have the choice whether to eat the chocolate bar or not?

    OF COURSE YOU DO.

    But if you have common sense you won’t eat it.

    Same goes with following God and the Bible:

    The Bible gives us the warning (paper wrapper)
    example:
    Gal 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
    Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
    Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

    Is there anybody stopping me from doing these things? Honestly now would it not feel good to the flesh having different sexual partners all the time?

    These things are enticing just like the chocolate BUT there’s a WARNING that says ‘they which do such things SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD’

    So I won’t do them.

    You get me?

    You have free will…how you use it is up to you.

    • Amen! God did not create human robots. Even though He have all the power to dictate what we’re going to do, He chose not. He wants us to follow Him and worship Him willingly. Such is His greatness and loving kindness, imagine we are nothing in the eyes of the Creator but He never fail to show us how important we are. To God be the glory forever!

  16. Open-Minded,

    I think your mind is still close about who God really is. I advise you to continue reading Bro. Eli’s blog to enlighten your mind and if you have further questions, you better ask Bro. Eli and stop making STUPID CONCLUSIONS okay…if you hae questions, ask Bro. Eli, the Bible has all the answers. May God enlighten you.

  17. we can never be really sure if we really evolved from apes. FIRST, NO LIVING HUMAN BEING NOW CAN ATTEST TO THAT CLAIM, ALL WE HAVE ARE JUST FOSSIL EVIDENCES AND SCIENTIFIC HYPOTHESES WHICH ARE MERE CALCULATED SPECULATIONS MADE TO SOUND LIKE A SCIENTIFIC FACTS BY SOME PSEUDO-INTELECTUALS. BUT THE FACT STILL REMAINS THAT WE HUMAN BEINGS REALLY CAME FROM DUST AND IT CAN BE SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN. the VALID question is: IS ORGANIC EVOLUTION NECESSARY FOR US TO CAME INTO ORGANIC EXISTENCE? DOES GOD USED EVOLUTION TO MAKE IT POSIBLE FOR US TO EXIST OUT FROM THE DUST OF THE EARTH? I THINK BRO. ELI SORIANO MUST ANSWER THIS QUESTIONS.

  18. in-connection to post #8.

    My friend i think its not appropriate to say “I love u w/ all my hypotalamus!” WHY?….

    …Simply because accrdg. to above article (Bro. eli)
    and i quote him “…It beats and pumps blood throughout the body unceasingly throughout ones lifetime without the control of man himself; while voluntary muscles moves are controlled by the mind.” and biblically speaking it is the HEART that serve as the control center for the mind it is evident in Prov. 23:7, ” As a man thinketh in his heart, so is he” and in Matt.9:4 reads ” Why do you think evil in your hearts” So therefore it is the SEATS OF HUMANS WILL AS WELL AS FOR THE EMOTIONS!!!….Thats why blessed are the pure of hearts!!!

    “It matters little, my friend how the HEAD lies provided the HEART is right!”

    ok thats all, I LUVU ALL WITH ALL MY HEART! (not hypothalamus!)
    c “,)

  19. Open-Minded,

    Where in the world did you find those ideas. I think ur just talking base on your self opinion. Otherwise, show me proofs in the Bible that waht you’re telling is true. Please be reminded that we are talking here about the wisdom of God and not self opinions and emotions.

    We not only have to be open-minded, we have to be BIBLICALLY-MINDED.

  20. May the peace of God be upon all!

    As always, Bro. Eli shows us a common sense approach to understand this very simple, yet was made a complex issue among these so called “free thinkers”
    Some how, with thier so called superior “intelligence” and “logic” these people deny the existance of free will to solve a equation hanging in the balance in their minds that up to now, is yet to be resolved.

    They for a fact cannot conceive how God, with all His wonderful wisdom and prudence, let people do such evil things and not do anything about it.

    They can’t understand why a God of love allows suffering, wars, natural disasters and poverty happen to mankind then comes a “christian apologetic” reason that it all happens because God gave us free will.

    They reason says ” If God knew that free will will create such a disasterous effect to mankind, WHY DID HE GIVE IT TO US IN THE FIRST PLACE?”

    They reason, ” God should have just created us as beings who cannot in any way, transgres His will.”
    For example, a computer will follow what ever program you install it. It “cannot so anything contrary to the given program”

  21. To Tolits Rodrigo

    The quotations from the bible (Proverb 23, Matthew 9) is True because mystically speaking there is what we called Heart Chakra, the 4th power stations which is compassion and mercy for people asking for forgiveness. It is the center of love and FEELINGS, its color is green.

    But neurophysiologically speaking, the heart is only a pumping organ, the hypothalamus is the one responsible for our feelings and thereby the statement “I Love you with all my hypothalamus” is true in the light of neurology.

    Is it clear now tolits?

  22. I don’t think that for man to be like a robot or a computer is the best way to live. Free will is a very wonderful gift from God, I must say.

    1. In fact, in the first place, every thing He made was very good.

    Genesis 1:31  ¶And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

    The thing is, man sought out many inventions.

    Ecclesiastes 7:29  Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.

    2. For God’s will for man is to:

    Ecclesiastes 12:13  ¶Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
    14  For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

    But man:

    Romans 1:25  Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

    3. This is totally not God’s fault, but man’s.

  23. OPEN,

    1. You said, “If a man has free will God cannot have fore-knowledge. This two things God’s foreknowledge and man’s free will seem to be incompatible.”

    The things is, according to the bible, there are things, which did not come to God’s mind. One verse says:

    Jeremiah 19:5  They have built also the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings unto Baal, which I commanded not, nor spake it, neither came it into my mind:

    And you should also consider what Bro. Eli wrote:

    “Free will or, better still, free choice is something existent in some, but not all, creatures. ”

    I think you should ponder on this.

    2. You asked, “Because what sort of God do we have who knows what we are doing and what we shall do, and still leaves it to our free choice to do whatever we like? And what sort of creatures must we be?”

    Like I said in #1, there are things, which did not come to God’s mind.

    But the God in the bible is:

    Psalms 100:5  For the LORD is good; his mercy is everlasting; and his truth endureth to all generations.

    And He will all men to be saved.

    1 Timothy 2:4  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

    His longsuffering is SALVATION.

    2 Peter 3:15  And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

    But:

    Ecclesiastes 8:11  Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.

    And these men have no fear of God.

    Romans 3:18  There is no fear of God before their eyes.

    But those who fear God, keep His commandments.

    Ecclesiastes 12:13  ¶Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

  24. In Connection to post #20.

    I think you have answered my question. And to Mr. Open-Minded, I hope you also realized the content of Mr. Rodrigo’s rationalization or let us say the verses that explained it.

    It made sense that the heart does have more power over our minds. If the heart stop beating and refused to go on, it results to death. Though scientist say that the memories remain in the cell neurons of the brain, still this is unfounded and needs to be proven. But if the brain tells the heart to stop beating or stop feeling, the heart will still continue beating or will still feel emotional or physical pain.

    How wonderful is God’s creation.

    Thanks be to our Creator.

  25. freewill or a capasity to choose what you like or want you to do was given us from GOD, if we are going to analize or think why we are doing these things at this moment[it is always involve our freewill] it is because you choose it, it is your decission that i cannot interfer even God, that is your power as a man but you should know how to use it for there are only two things will happen to a man, that is between good or evil.

  26. “If a man has free will God cannot have fore-knowledge. This two things God’s foreknowledge and man’s free will seem to be incompatible”.

    to open-minded,

    Are you saying that God’s foreknowledge is unable to see the outcome of our freewill that you have concluded them incompatible? Are having the thoughts that our freewill is as large as God’s foreknowledge that he can’t able to foresee its end? You must remember that God gave us freewill. Is it larger than Him that’s why you’re having doubts in your open mind that he has no power to know it? He said in, (Deuteronomy 30:19) “I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live…”) God’s foreledge is that if you choose life, you will live! therefore, the other is the opposite. Simple as that! May be you may have another idea about the foreknowledge of God and our freewill? ssD

  27. to open-minded,

    May I continue farther my humble answer to you. A freewill to choose anything on this life of us will have outcome only of between life and death. This means for example, if you want to eat, you can do so as long as you don’t disobey God’s will, otherwise, if you do, God’s foreknowledge for you is death because you disobey his will. What i mean to say is that gluttony is sin. A foreknowledge of God to us is very simple,ie, life or death. I hope you get me right. ssD

  28. ROMANS 9:20-21
    But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, “Why have you made me like this?”
    Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

    ROMANS 9:16

    So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth.”[g] 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He harden

    biblical freewill??? can somebody explain these—Shaman

    To Shaman,

    I think the verses you pointed out are not relating to the freewill that had been discussed here. Firstly, Romans 20:21, is saying about “thing formed” and “who formed it”. If you were blind since birth, You don’t question God why he made you blind while others can see. Our freewill doesn’t apply on this level. It is His will so that his immense wisdom can be shown in every way. The blind individual is given the freewill to choose whether he will follow life or death as stated in DEUT. 30:19, This is our level of discussion. Secondly, Romans 9:16 doesn’t apply to everybody. This event was showing unto all the earth that God’s power over the powerful pharaoh during that time, who boasted up to the power against Moses’ God, could never be equally surpassed by pharaoh’s gods. God is showing his majestic, eternal and powerful being to our state as a man made of dust. Again, the freewill is not the issue here. I hope you got me right.ssD

  29. To jet #25

    So brother in short in all appearances it seems that either God has fore-knowledge or man has free will. Both things cannot be at the same time If they are, then it is a great and important problem for us to know how such an obvious contradiction can be reconciled

  30. RE:Liloth

    Greetings!

    Peace be with YOU!

    Thank you for your compliment in my humble & simple way or may i say i’m just practicing my “freewill”..(i guess, my hearts dictates it) in accordance with the “spirit” within me, but it is God who truly enlights us and grants us wisdom to know the difference and knowledge in every dimensions of doubts it is “HE” who reveals secrets & mysteries of life and the world to come…. Praise and honor be unto God now & to everlasting!!! AMEN!…….

    Your friend in Christ,

    R.S.RODRIGO C”,)

  31. To all:

    It is better to call it “conditioned free will” and not free will at all. It is like playing chess, we may feel we have a complete freedom to move our pieces anywhere we choose. The moment we make our first move, however, we have restricted our freedom. Each subsquent move reduces our choices still futher and our options keep decreasing, move after move. Until such time, there is only one move we can make.

    If we our opponent is Kasparov himself he can decide at the outset to win the game at a certain point on the board. He being a grand master, can manipulate the game in such a way as to accomplish his purpose while, at the same time, letting us to feel that we made voluntary moves throughout the game.

    So skillful is the Grandmaster that his subtlety escapes the novice player. Who’s the real “Kasparov? and who’s the other player?

    Is it not God and us?

  32. To open-minded,

    Regarding your comment on post #24, and i quote YOU “…is true in the light of neurology” but if we will dig it deeply what controls the “HYPOTHALAMUS”? and what organ controls “THE MIND”? you think where will it falls??? BUT ANYWAY I WILL LEAVE IT BEHIND,, u agree in verses in the bible that i cited (Prov. 23:7 & Matt. 9:4), book of proverbs was written by the wiseman Solomon & the other one is Apostle Matthew they both have the same idea (…through God’s Spirit)
    and your belief w/c you based in “NEUROLOGIST”… MY question is who is much reliable? NEUROLOGISTS vs. KING SOLOMON/APOSTLE MATTHEW???….let the visitors of this blog decide!!! You are under ESTOPPEL u agreed the verses now u can’t either deny it! DON’T JUST BE OPEN-MINDED ONLY BUT HAVE A HEART ALSO TO ACCEPT IT!!! AND IT IS BIBLICAL…WE CHRISTIANS WE ALWAYS SAY “WE LOVE DEEP WITHIN OUR HEARTS!!!!!

    No HURT feelings!!! (how will u say that? “NO THINK FEELINGS”?)
    WE CAN BE FRIENDS NOT IN MIND BUT IN HEART…
    BYE AND GOD BLESS ALWAYS….(,”)

  33. To leo # 29

    Leo wrote: May be you may have another idea about the foreknowledge of God and our freewill.

    my response: If man has free will then it means that he can choose between various alternatives and as long as the choice is thus open it is undecided and unsettled, in short it is uncreated. It may fall on any one of the several alternatives which that alternative would be is not known yet.

    It is known to none, NOT EVEN TO GOD, FOR IF GOD KNOWS IT, it means that it is already fixed and the man has no choice.

    Now leo for the sake of arguments, let us say that God only knows the future actions of man but does not determine them, this however does not help us at all in settling the question of man’s free will b’coz even if God does not determine our future actions but as long as He knows them, the fact they are determined remains.

    Always remember leo : KNOWLEDGE OF A THING PRESUPPOSES ITS EXISTENCE.

  34. To leo # 31

    Leo: A foreknowledge of God to us is very simple,ie, life or death. I hope you get me right

    my response: NOt only life and death leo but everything. He knows everthing.

    “Whatever cometh into being, the name thereof was given a long time ago, and it is FOREKNOWN what man is, neither can he contend with him that is mightier than he” ( Ecc. 6:10)

    “Thou understandest my thought afar off” (Psalms 139:2)

    “Doth he not see all my ways, and count all my steps” ( Job 31:4)

    “He sees all their going (Job 34:21)

    He exactly ponders man’s behaviour (Proverb 5:21).

    He even knows and arranges all contingencies to happen (I Kings 22:39)

    Therefore, God knows all future things, Yes, all those things to come. If this were not so then He is not worthy to be called God of Wisdom and fountain of knowledge.

    If God does not know out future action then who does?

    If God is ignorant of the future, then we, mortals are greater than him because we know some things in the future. We know when the solar eclipse will happen, the next election etc. etc. But this is not so. NOTHING IS HIDDEN TO HIM! even our hearts, He is searching our heart but that doesnt mean he knows not our heart. If he is testing us doesnt mean he knows not our future action. Always remember darkness and light are both alike to him (Psalms 139:12)

  35. Once again…We proves that bible is an exact science…Freewil exist biblically and scientifically…Thanks be to God…

  36. to open-minded-#36

    “It is known to none, NOT EVEN TO GOD, FOR IF GOD KNOWS IT, it means that it is already fixed and the man has no choice”…

    You’re making the domain of freewill complicating upon your head. Imagine, not even God is able to know it! Who told you then, for the sake of argument, that if God would know it, he will fix it. God is able to know the desires of our heart. Isn’t that part of our freewill? Yes, ofcourse! But, will God fix them upon knowing them? my answer is “NO”. Because our freewill is independent and it is always seeing the two conditions afront. One is leading to life, the other is leading to death. One is doing will of God, the other is breaking the will of God. That decision at point of separation is the freewill i am talking about. Whatever it may be, the end result of every decision we make is of our own freewill to choose either life or death. There is no such thing as freewill unknown to God. You are just creating another. ssD

  37. #36—my response: If man has free will then it means that he can choose between various alternatives and as long as the choice is thus open it is undecided and unsettled, in short it is uncreated. It may fall on any one of the several alternatives which that alternative would be is not known yet—open-minded

    to open-minded,

    Your perception of freewill is choosing between various alternatives and yet the choice is still undecided, unsettled and uncreated. If this is the definition you are laying out, therefore, from your own point of view, freewill is choosing. However, how come it is uncreated while you can’t escape the fact that the various alternatives is created already? At the back of your freewill, figuratively, you can’t escape the fact to start choosing to the defined alternatives. Therefore, every alternative surrounding the freewill is defined. there’s no such thing as uncreated based on your own terms of alternatives. And those alternatives you are saying has boundaries that if you exceeded the will of God, the final judgement is death. Now, if your freewill doesn’t want to choose on your alternatives, therefore, biblically you’re unfruitful servant and deserve to be punish still. I hope you got me. ssD

  38. #37—-Therefore, God knows all future things, Yes, all those things to come. If this were not so then He is not worthy to be called God of Wisdom and fountain of knowledge—open minded.

    to open-minded,

    I believe so that God knows all future things. But does it mean then that he dictates our future? knowing is diferrent from dictating. God predetermines the outcome. His judgement is just. But he never dictates to interfere with your desires. It’s your freewil to decide your path. ssD

  39. #34—So skillful is the Grandmaster that his subtlety escapes the novice player. Who’s the real “Kasparov? and who’s the other player?

    Is it not God and us?—open minded.

    to open minded,

    Your open-minded mind is shooting away to openness of your imaginations. Aren’t you accusing God of his subtlety to fool us that we’re making our own decision but it isn’t. Oh, c’mon? Subtlety is only use to describe the serpent and not God. Whose side are you now, oh man? you better reconsider every word you wrote. Case dismiss. ssD.

  40. To leo:

    But Leo how can we be held responsible for our actions, when everything in our lives , our circumstances of birth, our educations, our family are all pre-destined? Did you choose to become a filipino? Is it your free will to be borne as a member of your family? Are we not all predestined leo?

    Yes we go through life, we do appear to be making choices. but is this free will not within the will of the Father?

    Is the director knows not the role of every actors and actresses?Is there any director that guide not his talents in showbiz when doing a movie? Is the director knows not the beginning and the end of his films?

    Is God being the ALPHA and OMEGA, author of everything Ignorant of our “Drama in life” here on earth? If He is indeed ignorant……………….. then who knows?

    NOne? Is God Ignorant? Is God not full of Wisdom and Knowledge?

  41. To leo:

    But Leo how can we be held responsible for our actions, when everything in our lives , our circumstances of birth, our educations, our family are all pre-destined? Did you choose to become a filipino? Is it your free will to be borne as a member of your family? Are we not all predestined leo?

    to open-minded,

    Your perception of predistination is not biblical. what i have understood from the bible is that God predistined his judgement. For example, In revelation it says that those fornicators, liers, idolaters shall go to everlasting damnation. Now, if you belong to this judgement of God you can’t escape from it. All your life is a waste if you do not turn around to accept God’s wonderful plan of salvation through Christ. The same way, if you walk in his path you will have everlasting life. Therefore, you’re still controlling your decision. You still have freewill to decide whatever you desires. Now, I did not choose to be a filipino, it doesn’t matter to God if you’re a filipino, or american, or greek, or heathen as long as you do his will, you will have eternal life but you if break, to eternal damnation. It is my call. God laid out his judgement. It is up to me to decide. God put us on earth. It is a vast area to do whatever we want as long as we don’t exceeded to fall into temptation and break his will, we’ll be better of.
    The predistination of those who are called are those whose decided to follow his will. The same way to those people who do not, and turn to their own way. The end thereof is death. I hope you got me. ssD

  42. If we our opponent is Kasparov himself he can decide at the outset to win the game at a certain point on the board. He being a grand master, can manipulate the game in such a way as to accomplish his purpose while, at the same time, letting us to feel that we made voluntary moves throughout the game.

    So skillful is the Grandmaster that his subtlety escapes the novice player. Who’s the real “Kasparov? and who’s the other player?

    Is it not God and us?
    ——————————————————————————-
    Dear Open-minded,

    In a given chess position, there are various ways on how to procede. For example, we have alternative A, B, C, D, etc. If the position is straight-forward, we could calculate or foresee the resulting consequences of each alternative. Perhaps alternative A would lead to a mate in 10moves, alternative B would lead to an endgame draw, Alternative C would lead to a loss of our queen, or Alternative D could lead to a slight positional advantage for us. Ofcourse we would not choose an alternative that would lead to our defeat, right? But this is so if the position is straight-forward.

    Sometimes, there are positions which are unclear. There are those positions in which you have to wait and see what your opponent is planning. You have to play waiting moves.

    A true chess player would in fact understand the concept of “free-will and foreknowledge” in chess and its relation to life.

    Garry Kasparov is a very good chess player. He could calculate chess positions with so much depth and accuracy(Imagine battling it out against Deep blue who could calculate millions of chess positions per second!!). In playing against a novice chess player he would definitely have an edge. But Garry Kasparov, with all his chess prowess could never know what your going to move in a chess position which is about equal. What your pointing out is the position in which it is already losing.

    Why?

    Because in that case, even how much resistance a novice would make, it would be hopeless since he is already losing.

    Take note, that before he came about this position in which losing is inevitable, he had a choice.

    He could have chosen this move or that move to keep the game equal.

    A simpler example would be a person jumping on top of a 50 storey building. Before he jumped, he had a choice not to jump. But when he jumped, death or serious injury would be inevitable. Even you could guarantee that he would suffer injuries. Why? Since you know that our body could not withstand that huge amount of force.

    In the same way, God gave us free-will. We have a choice and each choice has its own consequence.

    Like what Bro. Eli said, some( but not all) are given free will.

    I hope you got my point. That in life, likewise in chess, we are given a choice, a freedom to choose which move we are going to make. If you make a mistake, a blunder in your game against Kasparov and you would be punished. But in reality you could have chosen a better move, which could have lead to a win – life everlasting!

    To God be the Glory!

    Vladimir Kramnik ( Current World Chess Champion)
    The guy who beat Kasparov!!!

  43. Dear Vladimir (the guy who beat kasparov),

    Congratulations! And thank you for your comments! But allow me to continue discussing the Illusion of free will.

    In your domain which is CHESS, if a beginner is match against a master player like you, the beginner may feel a complete freedom to move his pieces anywhere he choose, but the moment he makes his first move, he restricted his freedom, each subsequent moves reduces his choices still further and his options keep decreasing move after move. Until such time that there is only one move he can make, You mr. Kramnik can decide at the outset to win the game at a certain point on the board. You being the guy who beat my idol can MANIPULATE the game in such a way as to accomplish your purpose while at the same time letting your opponent feel the complete freedom throughout the game (in a way you caught your opponent with guile).

    The key word is MANIPULATION.

    Mr. Kramnik, In spirituality our free will increases as we rise higher in consciousness, When we become one with the Lord we will be truly free, But the farther a way we are from the Lord, the less free will there is, due to the many circumstances of the mind which restrict our ability to make independent choices, therefore the term “Conditioned Free Will” is most appropriate to our situation on this plane of consciousness.

    You see mr. Kramnik, we feel we are free to choose, but in actuality we will have choosen what we were ordained to choose, we are all moving towards our divine destiny, although we may play out various roles along the way. We may have a slight degree of latitude in the lines they speak but the acts are written and move towards the Author’s conclusion

    Mr. Kramnik Who’s the author, and who is the player?

    Well, let us for a while forget about Chess and let us go to the domain of Bill gates – The computers.

    A computer is programmed to accept only certain information, the conclusion is inherent on the data, meaning the computer does not come up with any new information but simply manipulates the existing data in various and sometimes new combinations, It is a common knowledge in computer programming GIGO – garbage in- garbage out. In other words you will not get anything better out of the computer than you have put in. However it appears as if the computer has free will because it comes up with a logical and well thought solution to a problem. ONLY a critical observer to note that the computer is only giving out what was inherent in the raw data.

    Who’s the programmer? Who is the computer?

    Is it not God and us?

    Mr. Bill gates are you there?

  44. To leo

    Leo : All your life is a waste if you do not turn around to accept God’s wonderful plan of salvation through Christ. The same way, if you walk in his path you will have everlasting life. Therefore, you’re still controlling your decision. You still have freewill to decide whatever you desires

    reply: Leo, if there is no longing within you to be with God, you will not turn around to accept God’s wonderful plan! Who put that longing? Is it not God?

    Jesus saith:

    “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him” (John 6:44).

    Leo, you feel that you are the one coming nearer to Christ but It is God who draws you near his Son. Where is your free will then? Is it not your will within the will of the Father? In other words, your so called Free will is conditioned to his will, how can you say it is FREE? “Conditioned Free will” is the right term. Is it not?

    In another occasions Christ says: ” Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you and ordained you that ye shall go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain” ( John 15:16)

    Here leo, Jesus tells his disciples that they did not CHOOSE him as their master, as was their belief.

    To the disciples (just like you) may have appeared as if they had voluntary chosen Christ as their master. But it was their destiny to do so.

  45. Julius: OPEN YOUR MIND OPEN-MINDED.

    reply : If my mind is still not open, then I will not be here standing alone protesting against your common beliefs. Well, Julia este Julius what about your mind? Is it open? or super-ultra closed to the max at the highest possible level x 777.

  46. we humans must be very grateful having been given the freedom to choose.. still, of course, it must always be in accordance with the will of the One who gave us such gift..

    thanks be to God for enlightening us through Bro. Eli…

  47. OPEN-MINDED,

    You have proven nothing yet…and you’re own collection of PARABLES prove that your mind is still LOCKED!!!

    You’re insisting that the right term to be used is “Conditioned Free Will” instead of “Free Will”?

    The term Conditioned Free Will does’nt make sense at all man.
    You have to make your stand clear.

    Do we have free will?

    YES of NO?

    There are only two choices! And stop inventing illogical words okay!

    After choosing, defend your stand!

  48. #51

    Julius wrote: You’re insisting that the right term to be used is “Conditioned Free Will” instead of “Free Will”?

    reply: You inquired why “conditioned free will”? Let us hear king Solomon- the wise man.

    “There are many plans in man’s heart, but it is the will of the lord that prevails” (Proverb 19:21).

    Is it your will or the Lord’s will? (that must prevail).

    So our will is conditioned to the Divine Will of the Father, therefore the right term is “Conditioned Free will”. Is it not?

    Yes, you feel you have freedom to choose and that is the Illusion of Free will (freedom in the lowest perspective)

    Are you free to choose in the highest perspective?

    Ignorant says: Yes!
    Open-minded says: NO!

    We are dancing and the strings are being pulled by HIM. The only difference is that the realized soul knows HE is pulling the strings and the unrealized souls think they are dancing by their own efforts.

    But indeed the subject of Free and Predestination is difficult to understand intellectualy, because we have to look at the same situation from

  49. To Julius:

    You’re insisting that the right term to be used is “Conditioned Free Will” instead of “Free Will”? The term Conditioned Free Will does’nt make sense at all man.You have to make your stand clear.

    response: Yes, to the closeddddx777-minded individual like you “Conditioned free will” doesnt make any sense. You asked: Do we have free will at all? Let us hear king solomon – the wise man

    ” Many are the plans in a man’s heart, but it is the LORD’s purpose that prevails. (Proverb 19:21)

    Is it your will that will prevail? or your will is only dependent upon God’s will?

    Do you understand now the meaning of “Conditioned Free will”?

    So Julius, do we have free will in the highest perspective?

    Is it not God the one pulling the string?

    Who put that longing inside of you?

  50. continuation of #53

    …………But indeed the subject of Free and Predestination is difficult to understand intellectualy, because we have to look at the same situation from two perspective:

    P1: From the perspective of our own individual life (exist in time and subject to the law of cause and effect)

    P2: From the perspective of the Divine (exist simultaneously & timelessly).

    If we try to remember that we are an expression of the Divine, then it will be easier for us to go through events of our lives to reap the punishments and rewards of our karmas w/o falling into the TRAP of believing that we are in control.

  51. TO OPEN MINDED:

    Open your heart and your mind,not only your mind.
    Because the Lord searche’t the heart of the Man that have fear ,obey,repent and worship God in espirit and truth.

    I HOPE THE LORD OPEN YOUR HEART TO BE
    LIGTHEND!!!!!!!!!

    TO GOD BE THE GLORY

  52. James,

    Peace!

    Always remember my dear brother, – the FEELINGS behind your feelings, the POWER behind your power, the WISDOM behind your wisdom, & the WILL behind your will is the INFINITE LORD.

    your brother in absolute reality,

    william

  53. 48 OPEN,

    1. You said to Leo, “Leo, you feel that you are the one coming nearer to Christ but It is God who draws you near his Son. Where is your free will then? Is it not your will within the will of the Father? In other words, your so called Free will is conditioned to his will, how can you say it is FREE? “Conditioned Free will” is the right term. Is it not? ”

    Let me ask you some things. How about these people in:

    Jeremiah 19:5  They have built also the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings unto Baal, which I commanded not, nor spake it, neither came it into my mind:

    …was their will still WITHIN the will of the Father?

    Do you know who baal is?

    Isn’t it the will of the Father for His people not to have other gods before Him?

    Exodus 20:3  Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

    2. You also said, “We are dancing and the strings are being pulled by HIM. The only difference is that the realized soul knows HE is pulling the strings and the unrealized souls think they are dancing by their own efforts.”

    a. Ha? When these things that NEITHER came to God’s mind:

    Jeremiah 32:35  And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

    …was God still pulling the strings?

    How dare you liken man to puppets?!? Are you hereby liking God to be the master puppeter, also?!?

    b. When He said:

    Deuteronomy 30:19  I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

    …was He pulling the strings?

    He said, “CHOOSE”. Does not man have FREEWILL?

    c. How about this:

    John 3:19  And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

    …when men loved darkness rather than light, didn’t they choose darkness over light? They did in contrary to what God told man to choose in Deut 30:19, right? Didn’t they have freewill?

    Let me make it easier for you. Yes, they did! They even loved it, the verse says. See?

    d. And again, you should also consider what Bro. Eli wrote.

    “Free will or, better still, free choice is something existent in some, but not all, creatures.”

  54. Peace!

    Every mind, every power, every wisdom and every endeavor of man is always surpassed by God’s wisdom and power. So whenever doubts arises, just turn to the Holy Bible and if you do not know how to use it, just ask Bro. Eli and don’t doubt Him because Bro. Eli is only ONE that could supply with everything you need for a true salvation. Any other views, knowledge, informations and studies are only a sham , so don’t waste your time about those things. Just focus your mind to the Bible, Bro. Eli and GOD.

  55. Jet you quoted:
    Deuteronomy 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

    and you concluded: He said, “CHOOSE”. Does not man have FREEWILL?

    XXXXXX

    The above narration in Deut. pertains to the reality of this world and its many relative realities. We have free will here that’s why we can do whatever we like, If you want to KISS your pretty neighbor then you can do it BUT that action of yours is only part of your KARMA that needs to be fulfilled in order to finish the transaction, that’s meant by choosing in DEut. But the above assertion doesnt denotes ABSOLUTE REALITY.

    WHY?

    “There are many plans in man’s heart, but it is the will of the lord that prevails” (Proverb 19:21).

    Is it your will or the Lord’s will?

    So our will is conditioned to the Divine Will of the Father, Anything cannot be done by you except if it is approve by God in HEAVEN.

    IN summation: IN THE HIGHEST PERSPECTIVE Always remember the WILL behind your will is the ABSOLUTE LORD.

    Do you get the point of my narration mr. jet?

  56. Our moral freedom, like other mental powers, is strengthened by exercise. The practice of yielding to impulse results in enfeebling self-control. The faculty of inhibiting pressing desires, of concentrating attention on more remote goods, of reinforcing the higher but less urgent motives, undergoes a kind of atrophy by disuse.
    PEACE BE WITH YOU
    MICKY

  57. 59 DUKE,

    1. You cited Prov 19:21.

    You should first consider who the speaker is in that verse? What is his kind? And what kind of man was he talking about?

    2. Then you asked, “Is it your will or the Lord’s will? ”

    We should consider that the Lord is good, right?

    Psalms 100:5  For the LORD is good; his mercy is everlasting; and his truth endureth to all generations.

    I would presume that you are talking about sensual kiss here, right? But before I can answer that fully, we should first know what the will if the Lord is, regarding your given scenario – about, for example me, wanting to kiss my pretty neighbor.

    Matthew 5:27  ¶Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
    28  But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

    See? Looking on a woman to lust after her is already adultery, right? How much more is actually kissing her, right?

    Now, knowing the will of the Lord, which is of course not to even look on a woman to lust after her; then I tried to kiss her, which will was that? That was MINE, AND NOT THE LORD’S!

    3. I hope you could answer each of my questions in that post – not just one.

    4. You also mentioned about KARMA. Actually biblically this is NOT ALWAYS TRUE. Remember the other thief, which was crucified with him?

  58. PRAISE AND HONOR BE UNTO GOD. May the peace of the LORD be with you Bro Eli, Bro Daniel, ministers, workers, members of the CHURCH OF GOD International, and fellow bloggers. It is very simple to understand the message given by Bro Eli, unless the reader has a ‘hardened heart’ and would rather stick to their perverted belief received from the perverted teachings of the inc-ni-manalo. Revned, open mind and their likes do not realize it that the very reason the keep on questioning the TRUTH is because of the GOD-given FREE WILL to them. Twisting and giving differrent interpretation of the verses by these group is a proof of that free will. GOD’s foreknowledge and man’s free will has no contradiction, but it is only the personal interpretation by mr. open mind, who actually has a ‘closed mind’. I can only pray that people like you will still have a chance to enjoy the beauty and the salvation in Bro Eli’s preaching of GOD’s WORDS. Thank you very much Bro Eli and brethrens.

  59. Gal 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

  60. The explanation of freewill, with the addition of science facts were expounded real well that there was neither confusion nor additional question in my head. This article made it all the more clear how freewill is actually the most compassionate and loving expression of God’s kindness. Unfortunately, we humans abuse it.

    Thanks be to God for blogging this. Very helpful Bro.Eli!

  61. I really like the simple example you’ve mentioned that proves the existence or the reality of free will in man. Also the consequence if we do our own free will which are against the will of God. That really makes sense.

    One of my friend asked almost the same question about this things..I’m glad that there’s a blog like this that we could read to enlighten us.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s