Testimonial Evidences from Eyewitnesses to Jesus’ Miracles


blogbadge.jpg

There are four kinds of evidence which are acceptable to any legal mind, namely: (1) physical, (2) documentary, (3) testimonial, (4) analytical. The claim (see video below) of these ‘imaginary people that the miracles performed by the Lord Jesus Christ did not leave behind any evidence is unfounded and idiotic. Let us examine the issue.

In the first place, we have to consider the accounts in the Bible written by the apostles and evangelists, as testimonial and analytical evidences. John 20:30-31 says:

“And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.”

The miracle in Cana, turning water into wine, was witnessed by John and other eyewitnesses, wrote it in his account, and the existence of manuscripts dating back to as early as 120 A.D.(fig. 1), can now be considered as testimonial, analytical, and physical evidence.

These informations written in the Bible, written in ancient writing materials, and are now preserved in various museums of the world, whose authenticity and antiquity is unchallenged even by the detractors of the Bible, can be considered as analytical pieces of evidences.

Luke, a medical doctor and the only gentile writer of Bible books, writing to another Gentile, Theophilus, (gentile is someone who is not Jew), investigated the miracles and the works done by the Lord Jesus from eyewitnesses, wrote them in his gospel and in the book of Acts, left them as documentary evidence of Jesus’ miracles.

(Luke 1:1-3) “Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us, even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus…”

(Acts 1:1-2)“In my former book, Theophilus, I wrote about all that Jesus began to do and to teach until the day he was taken up to heaven, after giving instructions through the Holy Spirit to the apostles he had chosen.”

Note that what Luke wrote are accounts from eyewitnesses, and first hand informations, investigated with a perfect understanding of what factually happened.

The testimonial account written and left by the apostles can be subjected to scientific investigation by any legal mind, and can be proven true by collateral pieces of physical evidences.

The absence of physical evidence in our time does not mean that there is no evidence at all! The Lord Jesus healed a woman with an issue of blood for twelve years. Unfortunately, there were no medical forms accomplished and signed by the woman to have documentary evidence from the very person healed. It was not customary then. But eyewitnesses to the miracle wrote them and we have them now in the Bible. If only there were video cameras in those days, maybe these ‘imaginary people’ will believe! Further, there were no contending parties then that deny the authenticity of the miracles, so, the Christians did not see any necessity to preserve the remains of the woman that was healed!

(Matthew 9:20-22) “And, behold, a woman, which was diseased with an issue of blood twelve years, came behind him, and touched the hem of his garment: For she said within herself, If I may but touch his garment, I shall be whole. But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.”

These accounts written by the apostles, and were read by so many detractors of Jesus were not contested by the great-great grandfather of these ‘imaginary people’. The following are the collateral evidences to prove the authenticity of the writings of the apostles who were eyewitnesses to the miracles done by Jesus.

Roman coins found by archeologists prove the account in Matthew 22:17-21.

“Tell us therefore, what thinkest thou? Is it lawful to give tribute unto Caesar, or not? But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, why tempt ye me, ye hypocrites? Show me the tribute money. And they brought unto him a penny. And he saith unto them, whose is this image and superscription? They say unto him, Caesar’s. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.”

edited-coins.jpg

A piece of limestone on which the name of Pontius Pilate was inscribed proves the existence of the miracle-performing Jesus.

pontius-pilate.jpg

The Roman historian Tacitus wrote concerning the Great Fire of Rome, in book 15, chapter 44 of his Annals (c. 116):

“Nero subdidit reos et quaesitissimis poenis adfecit, quos per flagitia invisos vulgus Christianos appellabat. Auctor nominis eius Christus Tibero imperitante per procuratorem Pontium Pilatum supplicio adfectus erat;”

English Translation:

“Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius”

Even a Jewish historian by the name of Flavius Josephus wrote about the miracles and the works done by the Lord Jesus (- Jewish Antiquities, 18.3.3 §63).

Testimonium Flavianum

(Flavius Josephus’ Account of Jesus)

“About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Messiah. And when, upon the accusation of the principal men among us, Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had first come to love him did not cease. He appeared to them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had foretold these things and a thousand other marvels about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared.”

Unfortunate for these materialistic idiots, when Jesus performed a miracle of Himself when He resurrected from the dead, did not leave any physical evidence, because no evidence was left in the grave!

They say that Jesus did not leave behind any evidence of His miracles. Just look who is talking!

 

 

God Bless

item.jpg
EFS

83 thoughts on “Testimonial Evidences from Eyewitnesses to Jesus’ Miracles

  1. The Bible is the most scientific and most logical book I have ever read. I have found out and researched for myself, especially during the time it is clearly explained and expounded by the only God-sent preacher in these last days: Bro. Eli Soriano.

  2. Very enlightening!!…(and it is NOT imaginary)
    another interesting topic for all unbelievers
    i think it is time for you to surrender now, you imaginary being..

    Thanks be to God!!!

  3. From the evolution era to present time there are so many emperors, philosophers, leaders, inventors, pharaoh, generals, warriors, and kings are passing by of which considered greatest in the human history but still their names are graved in the history book, others are forgotten.

    And here comes a name called Jesus Christ from 2000 years ago, was born in a manger and in a poor family, belittled and died in a shameful manner by crucifixion but who’s name and doctrines now are known and believed if not but almost in four corners of the world.

    “They say that Jesus did not leave behind any evidence of His miracles. Just look who is talking!”

    “And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner” (Mark 12:10)

    EYES

  4. SNAD,
    THEY WERE CREDIBLE HISTORIANS AND THEIR WORKS AND WRITINGS ARE PROVEN RELIABLE AND FACTUAL. YOU ALREADY GIVE THE WEBSITE PLEASE READ IT FULLY.

    AND BY THE WAY GO TO THE DETAILED DEFINITION OF HEARSAYS. THERE ARE EXEMPTIONS AND EXCEPTIONS.

    “One major misconception about the hearsay rule is that hearsay is never admissible in court. While the general rule is that such evidence is inadmissible, there are many exceptions.”

    THAT IS QUOTED FROM THE WEBSITE YOU PROVIDED

  5. Jews generally rejected Jesus Christ and look what happened to them afterwards.

    I just can’t understand, that when the things contain in bible are getting clearer to us through Bro Eli’s reading, you will reject not only what he says, but Jesus Christ himself!

    By the way Snady would rather believed in wikepedia than that of the most read book of all times.

  6. Nothing good will ever come from perverts in defense of The Bible rather they never will stop in misleading people away from the hope that is in CHRIST which even the very science that they claim,used as their basis of maligning the Bible contradicts their imaginary minds!

    What the Bible taught are the things for the very building up of a very humane society and educating people from unsound doctrines which these perverts do teach and are the very proponents of stupidy down to the very extreme of foolishness to capture people and enslave to their imaginary doctrines which contradicts the very nature or feelings of the natural thinking humans taught by good reason not by sick, unhealthy imaginary people of pervertions!

    “None of the wicked shall understand”, “Nothing pure from foolish, imaginary sick perverts”, and never will there be hope to these proponents of pervertion that “do not” base their assessment of the Bible by The Bible itself!

    Their foolishness and ignorance of the Bible shall bring them to ruin, and their acts testify to it!

    More Power to you brother Eli

    GOD Bless in CHRIST!

  7. I DON’T WANNA FIGHT WITH YOU ADD BELIEVERS OR MR. SORIANO

    I’M JUST INFORMING YOU THAT JOSEPHUS AND TACITUS WERE NOT EYEWITNESS SINCE THE TITLE OF THIS ARTICLE IS KINDA MISLEADING TO THE PUBLIC

    “Testimonial Evidences from Eyewitnesses to Jesus’ Miracles”

    PUTTING OUT INCORRECT INFO JUST TO PROVE JESUS OR THE BIBLE WON’T HELP YOUR MINISTRY AT ALL

    IT WOULD JUST GIVE NON BELIEVERS A REASON TO DOUBT THAN BELIEVE IT

    P.S.

    SCHOLARS BELIEVE THAT THE JOSEPHUS QUOTE WAS AN INTERPOLATION(ADDED LATER BY CHRISTIAN COPYISTS)

    TAMPERED EVIDENCES, HEARSAYS OR OTHERWISE ARE NOT ADMISSIBLE IN A COURT OF LAW

    http://skeptically.org/chxbible/id12.html

  8. Josephus and Tacitus also believes on a historical HERCULES.

    It is also very curious how the first quote of Josephus talking about jesus was 312 AD when his writings have been around for more than a hundred years. All the christian apologists at the time know of josephus work intimately yet only eusebius started quoting him a few hundred years after he supposedly written it.

  9. Hey Snad and Samual, you really make me laugh…

    I don’t care if Josephus or Tacitus believed HERCULES (though I do really not believe that they do…any supporting documents?) are you telling the world that these historians are not credible at all?

    If so, can you tell or would you dare tell other Roman and Jewish Historians in our time that their great historians are just nothing but fools?

    I really pity these non-believers…

    P. S. Have you read II Chorintians 4:4? Better read it.

    and let me hear your reactions…. : )

  10. For those in these days who want a “Testimonial Evidences from Eyewitnesses to Jesus’ Miracles”

    Jesus christ foresee these days already and said in this manner;

    “Because I said unto thee, I saw thee under the fig tree, believest thou? thou shalt see greater things than these.” (John 1:50)

    “because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.” (John 20:29)

    “He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.” (John 12:48)

    “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.” (Matthew24:35)

    Now If the COURT OF LAW want a Testimonial Evidences, then he can pick-up and interrogate of its nearby church who believed Jesus christ which is the one who fulfill of what Jesus christ foresee that “blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed”.

    EYES

  11. hi snady

    you said and i quote:”SO BASICALLY, WHAT THEY WROTE WERE JUST “HEARSAYS”

    HEARSAYS ARE NOT ACCEPTED IN THE COURT OF LAW MR. SORIANO”. apparently, YOU REJECT ANYTHING THAT IS JUST HEARSAY OR ANYTHING NOT FACTUAL right?
    but then you also said and i quote:”SCHOLARS BELIEVE THAT THE JOSEPHUS QUOTE WAS AN INTERPOLATION(ADDED LATER BY CHRISTIAN COPYISTS)”. my question to you is CAN YOU IDENTIFY WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY THOSE SCHOLARS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING AND CAN YOU GIVE THE CERTAIN NAMES OF THOSE CHRISTIAN COPYISTS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING, WHEN THEY TAMPERED JOSEPHUS’S WORKS(EXACT DATE) AND THE SPECIFIC DOCUMENT(S) THAT WERE TAMPERED BY THESE PEOPLE AS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IN THIS PAGE. im snady that you are a factual person who hates hearsays and i just hope you will be able to answer my question FACTUALLY.

  12. hi snady

    you said and i quote:”SO BASICALLY, WHAT THEY WROTE WERE JUST “HEARSAYS”

    HEARSAYS ARE NOT ACCEPTED IN THE COURT OF LAW MR. SORIANO”. apparently, YOU REJECT ANYTHING THAT IS JUST HEARSAY OR ANYTHING NOT FACTUAL right?
    but then you also said and i quote:”SCHOLARS BELIEVE THAT THE JOSEPHUS QUOTE WAS AN INTERPOLATION(ADDED LATER BY CHRISTIAN COPYISTS)”. my question to you is CAN YOU IDENTIFY WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY THOSE SCHOLARS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING AND CAN YOU GIVE THE CERTAIN NAMES OF THOSE CHRISTIAN COPYISTS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING, WHEN THEY TAMPERED JOSEPHUS’S WORKS(EXACT DATE) AND THE SPECIFIC DOCUMENT(S) THAT WERE TAMPERED BY THESE PEOPLE AS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IN THIS PAGE. i expect snady that you are a factual person who hates hearsays and i just hope you will be able to answer my question FACTUALLY.

  13. This is a continuation…

    After the COURT OF LAW or UNBELIEVERS interrogate of its nearby church who believed Jesus Chist, then IF they can realized that the word spoken by our lord Jesus christ 2000 years ago was fulfill nowadays by its nearby church which stated “blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed”.

    Then,

    Therefore the UNBELIEVERS are NOW the EYEWITNESSES.

    EYES

  14. it is blessed for whom, who haven’t chance to saw him but believe in him….

    the freaks that always mess around…don’t know how to feel the blessings and love of GOD.

    and they protested about GOD and th Bible…you have the right to believe not…but should contested it…you are speaking awful things…like a stupid that doesn’t know what he is saying.

    just remind this saying (and a what i’ve heard in the bible):
    “Kahit gaano ka pa katalino o kahusay sa argumento… isipin mo na lang ito…wala sa masasama ang makakaunawa…”

    (T_T) sAD for you…

    Anyweiz… More POWER to you BRO. Eli…

    To GOD be the GLORY!!! SsD!

  15. the fact that the quoted historians wrote their pieces about Jesus Christ more than a hundred years after His death proves how significant a personality He was..

    the capital punishment during the reign of the Roman Empire was crucificion, meaning many people were crucified during that time.. but the name that stood out among those crucified was Jesus Christ’s..

    this is proof that He is not some common person

    as for the miracles.. faith is belief in things unseen, and those who do not have faith cannot really understand this for they are fools..

    does it really matter that we have physical evidence of His miracles? We already have proof of His greatness in the Bible, a greatness in wisdom that no other person in this world has shown..

    do we need actual eyewitnesses to account every single thing He has done? we can’t find any.. they’re all dead.. and all writings based on accounts of eyewitnesses, no matter how accurate, won’t be accepted by skeptics anyway.. they may say they’re tampered, modified, etc..

    in the end, all we have is faith.. and we are fortunate for this

  16. snady

    Lets take a close look at some of the scripture, inorder to make sense to you who is tampered and tampering, and by few passages taken from the Bible to test your claim as the scholars believed so.

    Scripture:

    “Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near.”

    Revelation 1:3

    This part of the Bible speaks of the end time, but must understand that as a reader,the Bible calls it “Blessed”, will you consider yourself one?

    Notice what CHRIST said as He calls;

    Scripture:

    28. “Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29. take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for Iam gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30. for My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”

    Matthew 11:28-30

    Will these scholars give us knowledge as what CHRIST offered? And a big why they spend effort,money, just to make sense that what the Bible teach are not and evidences were tampered to make believed of the Bible?

    Sripture:

    4. And Jesus answered and said to them; “Take heed that no one decieves you. 5. “For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will decieve many.”

    Matthew 24:4,5

    Now, who is and has been tampered and tampering? Are you aware of the present global,dominant religion? What about the many unBiblical religion?
    Will your scholars or your wits defend the Bible? If you read and are Blessed, will you ahave the courage to defend the infallable truth of the Bible?
    To consider your stand against the Bible, do yopu think that this information from the Bible is true at present? Is the Christ tampered or has been tampered for so long up to now that scholars say that evidences were tampered and the information are misleading non-believers?
    Get a grip, be reasonable! why on earth will these scholars spends or DEVOUT their time and stand against the Bible? Why are so many unBiblical religion exists today as what Christ said and are leading many astray? Will your wits investigate and prove as to who are and what are tampered?
    Blessed are you? Then read! and The GOD of peace in CHRIST will enlighten your hearts desire!

    Scripture:

    “Trust in the LORD with all your heart, and lean not in your own understanding.”

    Proverbs 3:5

    Is it not that the scripture stand to its authenticity by realizing the present condition of the diversed pervertion and misleading of many people of the false religion?

    Scripture:

    “Turn at MY rebuke; surely I will pour outMY spirit on you; I will make MY words known to you.”

    Proverbs 1:23

    Do you rest your hope,knowledge in men? What about GOD? Have you tried The Bible? See the big difference and who’s telling the truth and stand to its reputation!

    More Power to you Brother Eli

    GOD Bless in CHRIST

  17. @slowhand:

    Quote by Josephus speaking on Hercules:
    Chapter 15.

    How the nation of the troglodytes were derived from Abraham by Keturah.
    That from Surim was the land of Assyria denominated; and that from the other two (Apher and Japbran) the country of Africa took its name, because these men were auxiliaries to Hercules, when he fought against Libya and Antaeus; and that Hercules married Aphra’s daughter, and of her he begat a son, Diodorus; and that Sophon was his son, from whom that barbarous people called Sophacians were denominated.

    the passage where he mentions Jesus is highly contested as being tampered.

  18. It appears that many scholars are antipathetic towards anything proposed as evidence
    of Jesus Christ’s historicity. That’s how they get famous quickly these days. They raised doubts on the works of four major non-Christian writers of the late 1st and early 2nd centuries – Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, and Pliny the Younger.

    In this regard, we must view with reservation any scholar’s opinion for their possible prejudice, psychological state, religious motivation, and possible contempt for religion in general. Their opinions, after all, are sometimes worse than hearsay; for they are mere commentaries, specifically contrary opinions, on other people’s works. (Could it be that their motive in being contrarians is just to gain fame or notoriety?)

    Anyway, I do not know that a historian needs to be an eyewitness to an event or person to
    write something that is factual or non-hearsay. A historian of credibility might as well have based his assertions from physical evidences, public knowledge, and assertions by authorities who were themselves eye-witnesses.

    In the case of Josephus’ passage on Jesus, there may be some reason to raise the red flag.. Some claim it has been tampered with, therefore it cannot be admitted as evidence.
    The same, however, cannot be said of the one written by Tacitus.

    The passage written by Tacitus (c. 56–c. 117), in his Annals is considered to be authentic in scholarly cirles. Biblical scholar Bart D. Ehrman believe it to be conclusive of the historicity of Jesus Christ’s existence.

    However, there comes people whose religion it is to be anti-religion (if not anti-chistianity) and say this passage was also a mere interpolation by Christian copyists and never mind what some scholars think, “Tacitus” was never an eye-witness anyway!

  19. Now, regarding Josephus’ passage… It should be noted that only portions of it are contested as possibly having been interpolated or added later. If stripped of the alleged interpolations it would read something like this…

    “And there arose about this time Jesus, a wise man, for he was a doer of marvelous deeds, a teacher of men who receive the truth with pleasure. He led away many Jews, and also Greeks. And when Pilate had condemned him to the cross on his impeachment by the chief men among us, those who had loved him at first did not cease; and even now the tribe of Christians, so named after him, has not yet died out.”

    Note that the above still serves to prove the authenticity of Christ.

    Note also that every extant Greek manuscript contains the disputed portions. The said passage also exists in both Hebrew and Arabic versions. And although the Arabic version is a little different, it still contains the disputed section…

    Against this background, we must consider whether there is any merit to the claims of Snady and his likes. I, however, salute Snady for his frankness and honesty in expressing his contrary opinions. It makes the quality of the discussion here much more richer.

  20. the point is:

    1)Mythology and History is blurred during Josephus’ (and Tacitus) time as clearly shown by their historical references to Hercules.
    2)His mention of Jesus was allusory, and worse, his praises are highly contested as forgeries.
    3)There was absolutely no first hand account of Jesus in writing (contemporary/documentarty type). the earliest writings about him were the epistles of paul (50-60 ad) which was decades after his reported death, then the gospels decades more later.

  21. To Sameul:

    What’s the big deal with “Historical HERCULES” anyway? Do you believe that this HERCULES that they were talking about is the HERCULES in the Greek myth?

    I just want to clarify.

    I just want to know your point why you said:

    “Josephus and Tacitus also believes on a historical HERCULES.”

    What’s the point? Please reply. Thanks.

  22. Religious discussions always seem to lead to debates. Debates don’t really do much to enlighten people or educate them as well. People just go back and forth trying to prove their side of the story.

    It seems that most people want to be on the wining team all of the time. We all want everyone to agree with us. We never want to be wrong or simply won’t admit it when we know we are.

    It doesn’t really matter when an Atheist shares his views in a place like this. People won’t listen to him or her anyway because they have already made it up in their mind that they are right and that the Atheist views are not acceptable. This scenario can obviously go both ways.

    Why pity non believers simply because they don’t agree with you on one subject? People can agree on 99% of everything, but when you don’t accept Christ, you’d better watch out. You’ll burn in hell forever and ever. Why would I care if some person that died 1000’s of years before me is burning in hell right now?

    Some people seem to think that Christianity is the only way to live when it is very obvious that it isn’t. Just take a look around. I’m no Christian, I’m breathing the air that say was given to me by God, I don’t pray and I do just fine, but I always have people tell me what’s going to happen to me when I die. I can understand their concern if they believe that, but I just ignore it most of the time. It’s kind of hard for me to take advice from a person when they are speaking of an act that hasn’t even happened to them. How do they know what happens in the end and what happened in the beginning? Oh I forgot, the Bible tells us. Well, I don’t believe all of the Bible. To be honest, I don’t think that any book can be considered to be 100% accurate. Just because it’s on paper, it doesn’t mean that it is true. The brain that I have on top of my head simply will not allow me to believe a lot of what the bible says. Many things in the bible just sound like old folklore, but that’s my opinion.

    As far as Jesus performing miracles, I don’t have to believe them. Jesus walked the earth just as I walk the earth and many other people walk the earth and will continue to walk the earth for many years.

    I have the right to not believe that Jesus was conceived by a virgin mother. I have the right to not believe that he didn’t turn water into wine. I have the right to believe that he didn’t ascend into heaven. It is my right to not believe that out of every person that was ever born, Jesus was the only person that could perform such acts. I have the right to not believe that Jesus fed many hungry people from 2 fish and 5 barley loaves and by the way, did he feed those hungry people the next day when they were hungry again?

    We believe what we want to believe. We can’t do anything but accept that. You can jot down every book of the Bible and throw it in the face of a non believer, but what will you achieve? The only thing you will do is start a debate. Debating and ridiculing doesn’t do anything, but cause separation.

    I won’t talk down on a Christian unless a Christian talks down on me. I won’t call any of you here fools because I really don’t know any of you like that. As far as I am concerned, you all are probably wonderful people. Just understand that your way is not the only way. We can’t knock down the belief system of another individual unless we can see things from their perspective and that is something that will never happen. Since that cant be done, we have no other choice, but agree that we won’t always agree.

    Treat each other good while we are here. That’s the way I see it and I am an Atheist.

  23. All of you atheist are just saying an excuse because you won’t accept the responsibility of accepting God into your lives and to bow down to your creator. I can see that if you do not believe in God, you know very well that you aren’t his children.

    Mongrels! You dare say that you won’t care whether you go to hell or not but you curse God all the time for all the misery in your lives? Once my rival David was an atheist and he was saved by grace because he knows that without help from Wisdom, risking everything, not just his life but his ideals, will he be bound by love.

    Think of all the places you’ve been! What evidences do you have in science that explains de ja vu? Is it not upon by revelations in your dreams? Why argue upon historical authenticity when it is clear that Jesus Christ is the most prominent historical changer of all, know that there is a DATE A.D. and B.C. Time itself has bowed down to Jesus, and know you humans dare to tell that he is not true but rather a conjecture?

    I tell you, it is because of your own pride! Bro. Eli is a testament that he is the new Elijah of this age, and someday Samuel will again show himself.

    If you do not believe in the Bible then you are merely blind to see this evidence: BEHOLD OF THIS VISION:

  24. xman,

    We are impregnated of two realities asexually that we tend to be numb as we become the fetus, the mother, the slave of obscenity of which we take leisure of. We never dare to wake up or even twink an eye with the fear, worse, the pleasure of machinist wanting as heroes, forced to play a role opposite that which was written.

    Yes you are an atheist. That is the role you opted to play.

    And Jesus was remembered, not because the anti-christs adulterated His written life, but because He said:

    Mark 13:31 (KJV)

    31Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

  25. slowhand,

    my point is already stated in my earlier reply. mythology can pass for history during their time. the king james bible even has unicorns in them even tho bulls have been around that time in their area. If they meant bulls, they say bulls. they believed that unicorns exist in far regions.

    tho it is clearly not far fetched for a man named jesus to walk this earth 2 thousand years ago tho…. even then, historical accounts (other than the biblical works that were written decades later) are scarce and allusions at best.

    I myself do not find it hard to believe that jesus walked on earth. it’s just that a lot of things can be embellished over a historical jesus over 40-60 years of oral traditions.

    their are valid points in this page where he compares the books of mark and matthew. where mark’s work is in 80 percent of matthews work but he corrected some errors in mark when it comes to jewish tradition. mark was roman and the writer of matthew was a knowledgeable jew.

    http://www.biblicalnonsense.com/chapter16.html

  26. @QUIEL:

    my question to you is CAN YOU IDENTIFY WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY THOSE SCHOLARS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING AND CAN YOU GIVE THE CERTAIN NAMES OF THOSE CHRISTIAN COPYISTS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING, WHEN THEY TAMPERED JOSEPHUS’S WORKS(EXACT DATE) AND THE SPECIFIC DOCUMENT(S) THAT WERE TAMPERED BY THESE PEOPLE AS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IN THIS PAGE. im snady that you are a factual person who hates hearsays and i just hope you will be able to answer my question FACTUALLY.
    _____________________________________________

    JUST TAKE A LOOK AT THIS WIKIPEDIA ARTICLE TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus

    I THINK IVE MADE MYSELF CLEAR HERE.

    I’M ONLY DISPUTING THE FACT THAT THIS ARTICLE WRITTEN BY MR. SORIANO MENTIONS JOSEPHUS AND TACITUS AS EYEWITNESSES OF JESUS.

    AGAIN, I REPEAT:
    THEY’RE NOT EYEWITNESSES. SO, THEY CAN’T BE RELIED UPON AS 100% ACCURATE.

    AS FOR THE CREDIBILITY OF JOSEPHUS. MANY OF JOSEPHUS STORIES HAVE BEEN PROVEN FALSE BY ARCHAELOGICAL DATA.
    FOR EXAMPLE:

    According to Josephus the death of the 960 inhabitants of Masada and the destruction of the palace and the possessions were the premeditated acts of all the people acting in unison. But the archaeological remains cannot be reconciled with this view.

    MORE INNACURACIES IN JOSEPHUS
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/portrait/masada.html

    …..

  27. @QUIEL:JUST TAKE A LOOK AT THIS WIKIPEDIA ARTICLE TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus

    I’M ONLY DISPUTING THE FACT THAT THIS ARTICLE MENTIONS JOSEPHUS AND TACITUS AS EYEWITNESSES OF JESUS.

    AGAIN, I REPEAT:
    THEY’RE NOT EYEWITNESSES. SO, THEY CAN’T BE RELIED UPON AS 100% ACCURATE.

    AS FOR THE CREDIBILITY OF JOSEPHUS. MANY OF JOSEPHUS STORIES HAVE BEEN PROVEN FALSE BY ARCHAELOGICAL DATA.

    FOR EXAMPLE:

    According to Josephus the death of the 960 inhabitants of Masada and the destruction of the palace and the possessions were the premeditated acts of all the people acting in unison. But the archaeological remains cannot be

    reconciled with this view.

    MORE INNACURACIES IN JOSEPHUS
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/portrait/masada.html

  28. QUIEL:
    Take a look at this site to answer your question:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus

    i want to make myself clear.

    im just disputing the fact that this article mentions josephus and tacitus as eyewitnesses of JESUS.

    Again, I repeat:

    They’re NOT eyewitness. so they can’t be relied upon as 100% accurate

    Scholars say there are many INNACURACIES and embellishments in Josephus works

    http://www.allabouthistory.org/how-reliable-is-josephus-work-faq.htm

    Many of josephus stories and accounts have been proven FALSE by archaelogical data.

    For Example:

    According to Josephus the death of the 960 inhabitants of Masada and the destruction of the palace and the possessions were the premeditated acts of all the people acting in unison. But the archaeological remains cannot be reconciled with this view.

    MORE INNACURACIES IN JOSEPHUS works
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/portrait/masada.html

  29. I hope this comment gets thru

    QUIEL:
    Take a look at this site to answer your question:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus_on_Jesus

    i want to make myself clear.

    im just disputing the fact that this article mentions josephus and tacitus as eyewitnesses of JESUS.

    Again, I repeat:

    They’re NOT eyewitness. so they can’t be relied upon as 100% accurate

    Scholars say there are many INNACURACIES and embellishments in Josephus works

    http://www.allabouthistory.org/how-reliable-is-josephus-work-faq.htm

    Many of josephus stories and accounts have been proven FALSE by archaelogical data.

    For Example:

    According to Josephus the death of the 960 inhabitants of Masada and the destruction of the palace and the possessions were the premeditated acts of all the people acting in unison. But the archaeological remains cannot be reconciled with this view.

    MORE INNACURACIES IN JOSEPHUS works
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/portrait/masada.html

  30. i want to make myself clear.

    im just disputing the fact that this article mentions josephus and tacitus as eyewitnesses of JESUS.

    Again, I repeat:

    They’re NOT eyewitness. so they can’t be relied upon as 100% accurate

    Scholars say there are many INNACURACIES and embellishments in Josephus works

    http://www.allabouthistory.org/how-reliable-is-josephus-work-faq.htm

    Many of josephus stories and accounts have been proven FALSE by archaelogical data.

    For Example:

    According to Josephus the death of the 960 inhabitants of Masada and the destruction of the palace and the possessions were the premeditated acts of

    all the people acting in unison. But the archaeological remains cannot be reconciled with this view.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/portrait/masada.html

  31. funny…. thanks anyways for banning me… i know ADD and Mr. Soriano can’t handle the TRUTH and FACTS that’s why they had to ban my comments who may well destroy your faith..

  32. to Samuel,

    Good to hear that you don’t find it hard to believe that a historical Jesus Christ actually walked the earth more than two thousand years ago. At least we can agree on that one.

    Comes now the next level, if you will but continue in the search, are the things said about Christ in the bible true or not?

    You have good reasons to doubt the bible. I think its a healthy sign. It shows that you are sensible, that you are a reasonable human being.

    In as much as you doubt the reality of the biblical Jesus Christ, I suppose you also doubt the reality of Socrates whom we know only from the writings of his alleged student Plato. For all we know, Socrates may have been just a figment of Plato’s imagination, a mouthpiece for Plato’s own teachings.

    I suppose also that you doubt the real historical existence of one named Siddharta Buddha whom we know only from oral traditions later set into writings by his supposed early followers. Rumor has it that he never established a separate religion but his followers did.

    Then perhaps you also doubt many alleged historical figures and events, for if ever they actually happened or actually walked the earth, accounts of them are all hopelessly polluted with myths, fables, or worse, religious agenda.

    It is not too impossible to suppose there was indeed a historical Hercules, a prominent hero who later took on the legend of a demigod in the popular imagination of ancient folks. Humans, after all, are prone to fabricating and believing in myths and rumors even in our age.

    Samuel, I think your disbelief in Jesus Christ is not due to lack of independently verifiable historical confirmation about him but because his story is beyond what you think is possible.

    Would you believe hard documents, if they exist, of a man named Jesus Christ walking on water? Or you would be screaming impossible! Nothing but hogwash! A myth! Or at best it’s just an allusion meant to convey a psychological message!

    What if it happened just yesterday and attested to by hundreds of witnesses. Would not our educated psychiatrists scream of mass hysteria? What if newspaper reporters witnessed it, would they not fear ridicule by their bosses and peers if they publish it? What if they caught it on video and aired on TV, would not a legion of experts scream of forgery? Of a deliberate attempt to deceive a trusting public?

    What if you witnessed Jesus walking on water with your own eye, would you not perhaps refuse to believe? Would you not be fuming with a newfound mission to prove it’s all but a lame trick? I myself have a tendency to do the same. I don’t believe anything outright.

    You and I have a right to disbelieve, right? Of being not a victim of guile? Remember too, however, that we have a right to know truth whatever the truth happens to be. Know too that truth has its enemies, even in our day. This is true of political truths (who killed JFK), of scientific truths (remember Copernicus), of religious truths (remember how the Vatican of old suppressed the reading of the Bible).

    I hope Samuel, that in your attempt at avoiding myths, you do not fall a victim of the enemies of truth. You can disbelieve all you want but still I hope you can give truth a chance to prove itself before you close your mind.

    Life is too wonderful to close our minds to what is yet undiscovered or misunderstood.

  33. Samuel,

    Hey wait a second, you are misinformed brother.

    Can you prove that “mythology can pass for history during their time”?

    The HERCULES mentioned by “Josephus and Tacitus” was not a myth at all. They are not Myth Story-Tellers, they are HISTORIANS. Myth Story Tellers are different from Historians.

    The Hercules they mentioned is not a Myth at all. In fact, this Hercules that they are telling is a real person. In fact historians said he married Aphra’s daughter, and have children.

    Historians are NOT FOOLS to tell something that they really don’t know. For example, the Philippine History, I believe that sometime in March 1521, Magellan discovered the Philippines. I believed in it, because many historians have written it. The informations did not came only from my ancestors, but also from the Diaries of Spaniards that came with Magellan (which are stated by Spain’s Historians).

    You cannot prove that “mythology can REALLY pass for history during their time”.

    You must classify the difference between a Historian and a Myth-Story writers.

    Get out from the box brother. If you are inside a WELL, you might think that Heaven is just as big as your fist. But if you try to get out from it, you will see how vast the HEAVENS are.

    Be broad-minded brother. Do not make any conclusions if you are not sure of it.

    As Christians, we know what we are talking about. We do not speak anything that we do not know. And once we talk, we always make sure of it, that we have a basis. And that is the Bible.

    But if you do not believe the bible, then there’s no contest in it. Believe what you are trying to believe.

    Lastly, though you do not believe in our God, let me say this:

    GOD BLESS.

    May HE open your eyes to know the truth. We also have brothers inside the church that do not have a GOD before…

  34. I regard Bro. Eli’s posts like telenovelas or TV series wherein I’m always looking forward to its next episodes. I actually stop my TV watching habits and just read Bro. Eli’s blog instead. It’s really exciting and the Biblical facts contained therein are truly magnificent. Through Bro. Eli, I realize how good God is and how marvelous His words are. I pity those ATHEISTS who don’t believe in God.

    If their really smart, they better listen to Bro. Eli, and discover who’s telling the truth. Thank’s be to God and to Him be the Glory.

  35. HI xman,

    its really true that atheist exist…you’re a living example…i just can’t imagine…

    what is atheism anyway?
    Atheism=Disbelief in, or denial of, the existence of a god.

    Don’t you believe in God? THINK AGAIN dude!

    i strongly suggest to watch bro. Eli in his programs…hoping that in God’s mercy, you will be enlighten.

  36. Testimonial Evidences from Eyewitnesses to Jesus’ Miracles:

    Q. Does JC still do miracles until our generation?

    A. Yes He does.

    1) The blind can see.

    2) The deaf can hear.

    3) The mute can talk.

    4) The lame can stand and walk.

    5) Those who are possessed by evil spirits are cleansed.

    Jesus Christ, the Son of God has been performing countless

    miracles until the present day and until that day, when

    atheists and scoffers like xman, Samuel, Snad and Samual,

    and many others, shall see the Son of God, and they shall

    weep… (Book of Revelations).

  37. I expect atheists and scoffers like xman, Samuel, Snad and Samual, and many others to question whether my previous statements are true based on four kinds of evidence which are acceptable to any legal mind, namely: (1) physical, (2) documentary, (3) testimonial, (4) analytical.

    So, let’s analyze: Does JC still do miracles until our generation?
    Yes He does because my brother, who was formerly a blinded agnostic/atheist/evolutionist can now see beyond the visible.
    The blind can see.

    My father, who was formerly a deaf agnostic/atheist/evolutionist can now hear beyond the audible. The deaf can hear.

    My neighbor, who was formerly a deaf/mute agnostic/atheist/evolutionist can now speak of the invisible things not perceived by blinded minds.
    The mute can talk.

    My colleague, who was formerly a lame agnostic/atheist/evolutionist disabled by addictions to vices, can now walk straight on a path. The lame can stand and walk.

    Those prisoners (who were formerly agnostic/atheist/evolutionist) at the penitentiary who are awaiting executions for murder, rape, and other heinous crimes, have been cleansed after having faith and having been baptized in Christ.
    Those who are possessed by evil spirits are cleansed.

    Now, we have testimonial evidences from eyewitnesses to Jesus’ miracles. Complete names and contact numbers will be published for further testimonies and elaborations.

  38. The HERCULES mentioned by “Josephus and Tacitus” was not a myth at all. They are not Myth Story-Tellers, they are HISTORIANS. Myth Story Tellers are different from Historians.

    _____________________

    slowhand,

    they are not eyewitnesses and contemporaries of jesus, so how would you know they are 100% accurate in their account of jesus?

    josephus mentions jesus as “the christ” or the messiah

    the Christian apologist scholar Origen, writing a century after the time of Josephus, states clearly that the Jew Josephus does not acknowledge Jesus as Messiah. And yet later, after the establishment of the official Roman church the Christian Eusebius produces the only extant copy of the work of Josephus and lo and behold it contains a clear reference to Jesus as the Jewish Messiah.

    http://www.mwillett.org/atheism/jesusmyth.htm

    if you really believe in josephus: do a google search on the “credibility of josephus” and see for yourself if everything that he says in his book were accurate and archeologically supported.

  39. WARD BUENAOBRA,

    i strong suggest you watch this youtube video to be enlightened about your bible

    Bible: fact or fiction?

  40. brother eli just added facts accounts from historians, that

    it’s have to you if you believe it or not nor you question the

    integrity of it, but we’ve seen him for a long years and don’t

    go anymore to any historians etc.etc..but we’re Christians

    the living example from our past life we’re blinds, but now

    we can see..atheist its your freedom..Eclesiastes 6:12,

    God given us the will for our own self maybe that why u

    choose your own! but serving God is the greatest choice

    among all things…Eclesiastes 12:13-14..But we pray to all

    non-believers sometime, somehow you forseen what we

    have seen, bro eli. your the true God sent messenger! To

    God be the Glory! with his merciful Power! Amen!

  41. snaddy were you banned from commenting here? but why do i still see your comments,you should have been deleted,I’m sorry mister but you don’t have it in you to “destroy our faith” you say,May God forgive you and one day become enlightened,for if you’d only hear what we hear, if you’d only see what we see,if only…. then you would not say such things.anyways,I’d like to inform you that you would not take us down,you just don’t comprehend what you are saying.why not try to comment again and again and continue to listen that is my unsolicited advice.

  42. i still don’t believe in the bible

    it’s a hateful book that contains genocide, slavery, infanticide, bigotry, rape, incest and horrible acts. how could moral people believe in that book?

  43. Morrissey,

    “they are not eyewitnesses and contemporaries of jesus, so how would you know they are 100% accurate in their account of jesus?”
    _____________________________________________

    So for you, anyone who is not an eyewitness, does not have the right to tell anything because he or she did not personally have seen it, right?

    May you please answer this question:

    Do you believe in Charles Darwin’s Theory?

    If YES, did he actually have seen it?or is there an eyewitness?

    If NO, what is the belief of an atheist where man came from?

    Please answer. Thanks.

  44. By the way, if you really want an eye-witness. We can surely say that we do have it.

    The author of “The Gospel of John” is the evangelist John himself. He is an eye witness of our Lord Jesus Christ. In fact, there are SO MANY things that our Lord Jesus Christ did, that John have written about. But he did not write it all because the GOOD works of Jesus Christ is SO MANY as he have told in John 21:17

    “And there are also MANY THINGS, whatever Jesus did, which, if they should be written singly, I suppose the world itself could not contain the books that would be written….”

    Let us ask John… “John, what are the things you have written? Is it just a myth? Are you an EYE-WITNESS of our Lord Jesus Christ?

    John will answer…… in 1 John 1:1, 3

    “That which was from the beginning, which WE have HEARD, which

  45. To: Samuel and Morissey,

    By the way, if you really want an eye-witness. We can surely say that we do have it.

    The author of “The Gospel of John” is the evangelist John himself. He is an EYE WITNESS of our Lord Jesus Christ. In fact, there are SO MANY things that our Lord Jesus Christ did, that John have written about. But he did not write it all because the GOOD works of Jesus Christ is SO MANY as he have told in John 21:17

    “And there are also MANY THINGS, whatever Jesus did, which, if they should be written singly, I suppose the world itself could not contain the books that would be written….”

    Let us now ask John… “John, what are the things you have written? Is it just a myth? Are you an EYE-WITNESS of our Lord Jesus Christ?

    John will answer…… in 1 John 1:1, 3

    “That which was from the beginning, which WE have HEARD, which WE have seen with OUR EYES, which WE have LOOKED upon, and OUR hands have handled, concerning the word of Life”

    “that which WE have SEEN and HEARD WE declare unto YOU, so that YOU also may have fellowship with us. And truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son JESUS CHRIST.”

    Want an EYE-WITNESS ey? Then there it is…one of the Eye-witnesses of the Lord is John.

    If you still don’t get it, then stick on what you believe. But may God give you the chance to see from blindness.

    If you believe that you really are an intelligent people, you will consider other’s opinion. And try to weigh every details you are acquiring.

  46. Slowhand

    I may be the first to tell you this. All Atheist don’t agree with Charles Darwin’s Theory. I may believe some things on evolution, but I don’t live by it. Evolution is not a way of life for me. I assume that Christianity is a way of life for you. I may believe some things in the Bible, but I don’t live by it either. I simply don’t believe in an all knowing God whom had a son that was conceived by a virgin whom BOTH want us to pray and ask for forgiveness when we do what other people may consider to be devious acts. I believe in a force or forces of some sort that got us here, but I don’t feel a need to worship that force and I really don’t think that force would single out humans as the only species to worship it.

    People get caught up in this “either or” way of thinking. People will say that “God HAS to Exist because of this…” or “God DOESN’T exist because of this..” What about all of the other possibilities that could be valid? What if we are all right in our way of thinking? None of us can really prove each other wrong here. We simply make our post and go our merry little way. Everyone is only giving their point of view. We all have different point of views because we all live different lives. I mean, do you really think that we should all have the same belief system? I think not.

    I’m cool with my way of thinking, but I don’t expect ANYONE to think as I do or believe what I believe.

    Hopefully, we will come to a day where no one will judge anyone by his or her belief system. I also hope that a day will come when people will not try to force their beliefs on anyone else. Christians, Atheist, Agnostics, Muslims, Buddhist, Mormons or any other religious sect out there….we are all humans, yet we are all unique in our own way.

    Peace to all!!

  47. hey snady, i got this from the webpage you gave me to answer my SPECIFIC question:”On the other hand, while this argument asserts that Josephus could not have written the Testimonium in its current form, it also demonstrates, according to some scholars, [attribution needed] that Josephus must have written something about Jesus, for otherwise Origen would have no reason to make the claim that Josephus “did not accept Jesus as Christ.” (While the claim that Josephus “did not accept Jesus as Christ” can be based on the fact that he was by all accounts a traditional Jew, this fact would make his nonacceptance of Jesus go without saying; the fact that Origen said it at all suggests a context of Jesus existed in Josephus’ work.) Presumably whatever he did write was sufficiently negative that Origen chose not to quote it.[citation needed]

    However, there are other arguments as to why Origen would have said Josephus did not accept Jesus as the Christ and is it worth noting that no “sufficiently negative” Josephus quote has ever surfaced. It may have been Josephus’ silence on the matter as well as his Judaism that led to Origen’s comment.[citation needed] Or it could be Josephus’s statement in Jewish War 6.5.4, where he declares that the Jewish messianic prophecies were really about the victorious emperor Vespasian that led him to believe Josephus did not accept anyone as a messiah. Since Origen makes no mention of negative comments by Josephus it can be argued that if Origen had read these comments he would have attempted to rebuke them and not chosen to ignore them in his writings.[citation needed] The fact that he did not do so gives credibility to the argument that no such writings existed at the time, but were a later interpolation.”. OBVIOUSLY, YOU REALLY DONT UNDERSTAND MY QUESTIONS DO YOU SNADY? THE REFERENCE YOU GAVE ME IS VERY INCONCLUSIVE TO ANSWER ALL MY QUESTIONS DIRECTED TO YOU SNADY. WHO WHERE THOSE SCHOLARS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING? WHO WHERE THOSE CHRISTIAN COPYISTS THAT YOU ARE SAYING? WHEN DID THOSE CHRISTIAN COPYISTS ALTERED JOSEPHUS’S WORK? WHAT IS THE CONCLUSIVE PROOF THAT JOSEPHUS’S WORKS WERE REALLY ALTERED BY THESE UNIDENTIFIED CHRISTIAN COPYIST THAT YOU ARE SAYING? SNADY, HOW WILL YOU CONVINCE ANYBODY TO BELIEVE YOU WHEN YOU DONT REALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE DEFENDING. NEXT TIME YOU POST HERE PLEASE BE ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN OF YOUR REFERRENCES AND EVIDENCES WILL YOU.

    you also said and i quote:”I’M ONLY DISPUTING THE FACT THAT THIS ARTICLE WRITTEN BY MR. SORIANO MENTIONS JOSEPHUS AND TACITUS AS EYEWITNESSES OF JESUS.”. my question to you snady is WHERE IN THIS ARTICLE CAN YOU FIND THAT MR. SORIANO MENTIONS JOSEPHUS AND TACITUS AS EYEWITNESSES OF JESUS? CAN YOU SHOW A VALID PROOF THAT MR. SORIANO MENTIONED SUCH AS WHAT YOU ARE ACCUSING MR. SORIANO?

  48. snady said and i quote:”funny…. thanks anyways for banning me… i know ADD and Mr. Soriano can’t handle the TRUTH and FACTS that’s why they had to ban my comments who may well destroy your faith..” SNADY, I THINK YOU ARE REALLY OUT OF YOUR SANITY. WHY WOULD ANYBODY BAN YOU HERE WHEN ALL YOU HAVE ARE NOT FACTS AND TRUTHS BUT GUESSES AND ESTIMATIONS AND NOTHING IS CERTAIN WITH THOSE TRUTH AND FACTS THAT YOU ARE MENTIONING. WHY WOULD YOU BE BANNED? FOR ME THERE IS NO REASON FOR THE MODERATOR TO DO THAT BECAUSE, FORGIVE ME TO SAY THIS SNADY, YOUR POSTS HERE ARE IGNORABLE IN FACT IT MAKES ME LAUGH. MODERATOR PLEASE DONT BAN SNADY HERE WILL YOU? I DOUBT IF THE MODERATOR DOES THAT TO IMPERTINENT, UNSUBSTANTIVE POSTS LIKE THAT OF SNADY.

  49. xman, ( xtraordinary man )

    i had a friend almost same as ur belief, she believe that all

    existance of things even us in this earth by a force and

    govern by balance..like there is good and bad, there is ugly

    and beautiful, there is death and be born etc..

    but all of it is written in the bible, i considered the life of

    human being his doing, attitudes, works, from past, present

    up to future…it is the basis of faith nothing more..

    just keep in mind all the existance of all that u see there is

    a creator and even the things that u don’t see like spirits,

    air there is a creator, even an animation have a creator….

    Bible not containing all words of God but all kind of

    people just to remind us, for everything..if you study on

    school you have the basis for everything you do, if your

    basis is only yourself you cannot learn, how about for faith

    God provided us the bible for us to have a basis for

    Salvation..we can judge that u are wrong if your basis is

    only your words, base on the bible no man that walketh

    can straightening his way without God, even us Christians..

    bro. eli is not forcing his belief to anyone you can watch

    him in several programs like in UNTV37..he is showing the

    real truth no matter what..

    But you have your freedom of choice, but as friendly advice

    keep in touch and listen to bro. eli….

  50. slowhand,

    you’re obviously ignorant of the history of the new testament bible. the authors of the 4 gospels are anonymous in the original manuscripts. The titles “Gospel According to Matthew,” Gospel Accordin to John ” “Gospel accordin to Luke, Gospel According to Mark., were not added until late in the second century. Thus, although Papias ca. 140 CE (‘Common Era’) knows all the gospels but has only heard of Matthew and Mark, Justin Martyr (ca. 150 CE) knows of none of the four supposed authors. It is only in 180 CE, with Ireneus of Lyons, that we learn who wrote the four “canonical” gospels and discover that there are exactly four of them because there are four quarters of the earth and four universal winds. Thus, unless one supposes the argument of Irenæus to be other than ridiculous, we come to the conclusion that the gospels are of unknown origin and authorship, and there is no good reason to suppose they are eye-witness accounts of a man named Jesus of Nazareth.

    the author of the gospel of john is not written by john, it was just attributed to HIM by early church fathers to add apostolic authority to those books “hence the title, “Gospel according to JOhn”. in other words, the author is not an EYE WITNESS.

  51. by the way you mentioned the author of that gospel (attributed to john) , was an an eyewitness, if he was really an eye witness of jesus, why did he contradict the other gospels on the Crucifixion account. there’s a possibility that the guy who wrote that book was just making things up, exageerrating and embelleshing since there’s a agenda why he’s writing it.

    john 20:31But these are written that you may[a] believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

    prophet mohammed also wrote the same things about quran, he claims he was an eyewitness of god. he also wrote about miracles and his visions . but why don’t CHRISTIANS believe in mohammed’s claims?

    http://muslim-canada.org/quran_inspiration.html

  52. if the author of john was an eyewitness as you say , then why did it contradict the other gospels(mark, luke, and matthew) in account of trial and execution of jesus? ( that book of course is not really authored by john the apostle)

    the author of john’s version of the crucifixion (john 19:17-34) contradicts that of the synoptic gospels on just about every point. In John there is no account of darkness at noon, no earthquake, no torn temple veil, nor resurrected saints. Also, Jesus carries the cross, and there is no mention of Simon of Cyrene. The overhead inscription reads, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS in three languages – Hebrew, Latin and Greek. According to John 19:14 the crucifixion took place at the sixth hour, noon but, according to Mark 15:25 it was at the third hour, nine am.

    according to Mark, the trial and execution of jesus all took place on Nissan 15, the first day of Passover. While Matthew and Luke may disagree with some of the details of Mark’s story, they do agree with his timing. (See Matthew 26:17-20) and Luke 22:7-14.)

    The writer of John makes it very clear in verses 14-16, 31 and 42 of chapter 19 that the arrest, trial and crucifixion of Jesus took place on the day of preparation for Passover. That would have been Nissan 14. This date is again confirmed in John 18:28 where it tells how the Jews escorting Jesus to Pilate’s hall of judgment refused to enter because in doing so they would have been (ritually) defiled and thereby disqualified from partaking of Seder scheduled for that evening.

    The question that naturally comes to mind is, “Why would John change the crucifixion date from Nissan15 to Nissan 14?

    This contradiction remains irresolvable thereby justifying serious doubts as to the authenticity of the entire story.

  53. slowhand,

    evolution has been observed/witnessed in the laboratory. bacteria undergoes evolution all the time, hence we get new strains of bacteria, viruses like sars, HIV, ebola virus all the time. they mutate to become antibiotic resistant etc. this is evolution in action.

    we have fossils and the DNA biological clock as evidence to determine when our ancestors and modern human separate.
    (the courts even use DNA paternity test to determine the father and mother of a child)

    our DNA shows, we are cousins with chimps and we share a common ancestor with them. that is to say, we did not come from monkeys but monkeys and Humans came from the SAME ancestor.

  54. Morissey,

    I am not ignorant when it comes to the bible’s history. Your claims that there are contradictions in the bible only shows how ignorant you are when it comes to the scriptures.

    Ask bro. Eli if there is a contradiction between the gospel of John and the other Gospels. I guarantee there is NONE. You just don’t know how to explain those questions in your mind. But we, INSIDE the Church of GOD, (with God’s help), we knew it. If you want to solve those puzzles, just continue listening to the one and only sensible preacher in our time.

    I am thanking my God that he let us know the truth. That we can prove that there are no contradictions at all. It will be a waist of time if I explain the verses, after all, (you will not accept it) you do not believe in the bible.

    Your question : “Why would John change the crucifixion date from Nissan15 to Nissan 14?

    Try to ask it to our preacher….you’ll see.
    : )

  55. Morissey,

    Anyway, you said: “(that book of course is not really authored by john the apostle)”

    If I can prove here that the Gospel of John was really written by JOHN THE APOSTLE, will you accept that you are really an ignorant man that speaks something that you really don’t understand?…

  56. slowhand,

    why not answer it yourself since you claim the members of church of god knew how to explain it. it would be a waste of time to keep me waiting for your preacher to answer it. this is his blog anyway so he can answer my queries here, but im not sure if he would bother at all

    prove to me that it was really written by john the apostle.
    and that john and the gospels didn’t contradict each other.

  57. TO SNADY (& his friends),

    I don’t understand what you’re trying to say. In your haste to try to “destroy” our faith, i think you committed a major blunder!

    Nowhere in this article did brother Eli claim that Josephus and Tacitus were eyewitnesses to Jesus !!!!

    Brother Eli only offered their writings as collateral evidence to corroborate the claims of the apostles. It is the apostles who brother Eli mentioned as eyewitnesses but unfortunately for you, you reject their testimonies.

    Brother Eli’s point is clear. The writings of the apostles, the unearthed archaeological finds, and the writings of historians, they all point to a singular fact: Jesus did walked the earth and his existence in history is well documented.

    I think it is your profound faith in “Jesus as a myth” that has caused you to misread the facts surrounding brother Eli’s post. Don’t let your raging bias blind you to facts.

    We are reasonable people who routinely entertain contrary notions about the bible. But the next time you try to “destroy” our faith, better argue from facts and employ sound logic. Don’t invent a weak spot, which you will then try to debunk with all your might. And don’t invent a ploy just to save face (such as being banned), we don’t know who you are anyway.

  58. Morissey,

    Sure, I will prove it.
    But post first your comment here that will say that you accept that you are an ignorant man that speaks something that you really don’t understand, before I prove it. Something like this:

    “I, MORISSEY accepts SLOWHAND’s challenge. That if he has proved here that JOHN THE APOSTLE is the author of the GOSPEL OF JOHN, I accept that I am an ATHEIST that speaks something that I really don’t understand. And I PROMISE that I will NEVER EVER say SOMETHING or ANYTHING STUPID to people, most especially when it is about the scriptures of the HOLY BIBLE.”

    Do you accept it?

  59. journeyists,

    your proofs are disputable, so it doesn’t prove anything.

    josephus account is disputable- he’s not an eyewitness and many of his stories have been disproven by archeological evidence eg. the masada suicide

    the gospels are disputable- the authors of the gospels were unknown and they contradict each other. john claims the crucifixion took Place on NISAN 14, the other 3 gospels claims it was on NISAN 15.

    the archeological findings doesn’t prove the entire bible-there maybe portions of the bible that is supported by archeology but there are also portions of the bible that are contradicted by archeology

    A notable example would be the account of Joshua’s conquest and destruction of the Canaanite city of Ai. According to Joshua 8, Israelite forces attacked Ai, burned it, “utterly destroyed all the inhabitants,” and made it a “heap forever” (vs:26-28). Extensive archaeological work at the site of Ai, however, has revealed that the city was destroyed and burned around 2400 B. C., which would have been over a thousand years before the time of Joshua. Joseph Callaway, a conservative Southern Baptist and professor at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, spent nine years excavating the ruins of ancient Ai and afterwards reported that what he found there contradicted the biblical record.

    The Moabite Stone, for example, corroborates the biblical claim that there was a king of Moab named Mesha, but the inscription on the stone gives a different account of the war between Moab and the Israelites recorded in 2 Kings 3. Mesha’s inscription on the stone claimed overwhelming victory, but the biblical account claims that the Israelites routed the Moabite forces and withdrew only after they saw Mesha sacrifice his eldest son as a burnt offering on the wall of the city the Moabites had retreated to (2 Kings 3:26-27). So the Moabite Stone, rather than corroborating the accuracy of the biblical record, gives reason to suspect that both accounts are biased. Mesha’s inscription gave an account favorable to the Moabites, and the biblical account was slanted to favor the Israelites.

    no archeological findings SUPPORT the existence of solomon, david in the bible. Another case in point is the biblical record of the exodus of the Israelites from Egypt and their subsequent 40-year wandering in the Sinai wilderness. According to census figures in the book of Numbers, the Israelite population would have been between 2.5 to 3 million people, all of whom died in the wilderness for their disobedience, yet extensive archaeological work by Israeli archaeologist Eliezer Oren over a period of 10 years “failed to provide a single shred of evidence that the biblical account of the Exodus from Egypt ever happened”

    it’s not uncommon for ancient myth and story writers to incorporate real places, historical characters in their stories(even dan bowne incorporated real places and characters in his book), so archeological support in some passage of the bible doesnt mean a proof for the whole bible

  60. prove to me that the book of john didn’t contradict the other 3 gospels regarding crucifixion (Nisan 14 vs Nisan 15) and
    prove to me that the book of john was really authored by JOHN the apostle

    “I, MORISSEY accepts SLOWHAND’s challenge. That if he has proved here that JOHN THE APOSTLE is the author of the GOSPEL OF JOHN, I accept that I am an ATHEIST that speaks something that I really don’t understand. And I PROMISE that I will NEVER EVER say SOMETHING or ANYTHING STUPID to people, most especially when it is about the scriptures of the HOLY BIBLE.”

  61. Morissey,

    First we, have to know the character of the writer in that gospel. The writer of the Gospel of John has a unique characteristic.

    In the last part of the gospel, we can read:

    “This is the disciple who TESTIFIES of these things and WROTE these things. And we know that his testimony is true” — John 21:24

    Who is this disciple who wrote these things? If you will read earlier in that verse. We can see that the writer of the gospel is along with Peter when they tried to fish, at the third time that Jesus was revealed to them.

    “This is now the three times Jesus was revealed to His disciples, He being risen from the dead”
    —-John 21:14

    This is also the time when Jesus talked to His disciples after fishing. And there is a situation when Jesus want to talk to Peter:

    “…And when he had spoken this, He said to him, Follow Me.” —-John 21:19

    “Then Peter, turning around, saw the DISCIPLE WHOM JESUS LOVED following (the one who also leaned on His breast at supper, and said, Lord, who is he betrays You?”
    —-John 21:20

    “Seeing him, Peter said to Jesus, Lord, and what of this one?” —–John 21:21

    So when Jesus said to Peter “Follow me”, the DISCIPLE which was the author of the Gospel himself also followed. So, Peter ask: “Lord why is this man also followed?”

    Jesus answered:
    “…If I desire that he remain until I come, what is that to you?You follow Me.” —John 21:22

    “Then this saying went abroad among the brothers that that DISCIPLE should not die. Yet Jesus did not say to him, He shall not die, but, If I desire that he remain until I come, what is that to you?”—- John 21:23

    Who is this DISCIPLE that they tought that will not die? Let’s read again:

    “This is the disciple who TESTIFIES of these things and WROTE these things. And we know that his testimony is true” — John 21:24

    This disciple is the author of the gospel. So, Based from the verses we have read, do you agree that this DISCIPLE WHOM JESUS LOVED is the writer of the gospel? Please answer me before I continue. You see, this is a very broad topic or study.

    To be continued….

    By the way, I am sorry if I cannot type it at once, since I am working in a company. I am only have an access during lunch time or should I say after lunch. I hope you understand. Would you mind if we talk on mail?
    And can I ask if you are a Filipino? So that I’ll know if I can speak also in tagalog.

    One more thing, I did not say that I will prove about the “Nissan” issue. The author of the gospel is the one I challenged is in it?

    Thanks.

  62. the abrupt shift from third person to first person in vss. 24-25(“WE know that HIS”) indicates that the author of the epilogue, who is supposed a third-party editor, claims the preceding narrative is based on the Beloved Disciple’s testimony, while he himself is not the Beloved Disciple

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_John

    i prefer to talk here and yes i’m filipino

  63. the author of the gospel of john could not have been the apostle john. heres why

    1. the author of john makes little reference to Galilee, which is scarcely what we would expect from a native of the province, especially since Galilee (supposedly) was the centre of Christ’s ministry. Nor does he mention at all his brother James.

    2. the author of John does NOT mention the ‘Transfiguration’ – when supposedly Jesus was joined by Moses and Elias on a mountain top, transformed into “glory” and was addressed by God himself – an astounding omission considering that we are informed by each of the synoptic gospels that John was one of only three eye witnesses to this stunning miracle! (mark 9:2,9)

    3. the author of john omits any mention of the raising of Jairus’s daughter but according to Mark’s gospel it was John who was a privileged witness: Mark 5:37,42.

    4. the author does not mention the ‘Ascension’, one of the crucial events of the whole Christian story. Yet apparently John was a witness to this grand finale whereas the two reporters of the bizarre story (Mark and Luke) were not!
    Luke 24:33,51.

    5. the duration of Christ’s public ministry is extended by the author of John from one year to over three years, during which time the author of John recounts three visits by Jesus to Jerusalem, not just one; within this extended time frame, John moves the so-called ‘purification of the temple’, which the synoptics put at the end of the Christ’s ministry, to the beginning.

    6. the author of John does not agree with the others on the day of crucifixion – surely an occasion of the utmost import? the author of John says Christ held his last supper with his apostles on Thursday; according to the synoptics, the last supper was on Friday.

    7. the author of John’s Gospel is the work of a trained mind who wrote good Greek with some semitizing; but Acts 4:13 says that John was illiterate.

  64. Morrissey,

    That is why I am telling you that this writer is unique. The way he delivered the gospel is very unique since he himself is among with the characters.

    Just like Moses did when he wrote his 5 books (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy)

    Let me give you an example:

    “And he said, I am the God of your fathers, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And MOSES hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God” ——Exodus 3:6

    In this verse, he (MOSES) can write “And he said to ME, I am the God….”

    but HE DID NOT DO IT THAT WAY. What is my point? A person can tell a story, that actually also pertains to him. In fact he can never tell something about the scenario if he is not actually there. There are only 2 characters, the God and Moses. But Moses delivered the story as if somebody or someone is telling it.

    The way Moses writes, is also the way of writing used by the BELOVED Disciple.

    When the writer tried to tell the story, he hid his personality in the so called “beloved discpile”.

    Let me give you another example.

    In John 6:54, Jesus said this to HIS disciples:
    “Whoever partakes of My flesh and drinks of My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.”

    Hearing this statement, some of the disciples, got offended:
    “Then when they had heard, many of His disciples said, This is a hard saying, who can hear it?” —–John 6:60

    These disciples thought that they have to eat Jesus’ flesh and drink His blood literally. So many got offended and did not continue to follow Jesus. So what happened next?

    “From this time many of His disciples went back into the things behind, and walked no more with HIM” —–John 6:66

    So this people who took Jesus’ words literally did not follow HIM anymore.

    “Then Jesus said to the TWELVE, Do you also wish to go away?” —-John 6:67

    “Then Simon Peter answered HIM, Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the Words of eternal life” —–John 6:68

    Now, what is my point here? The writer of this gospel is among the TWELVE when Jesus asked “Do you also wish to go away?” Otherwise, IF the WRITER is not among the 12, then WHO WILL WRITE the STORY UNTIL THE END?

    The next question is, who are these 12 that left after the scenario? Let us read:

    “And the names of the twelve apostles are these: First, Simon, who is called PETER, and ANDREW his brother; JAMES the son of Zebedee and JOHN his brother;

    PHILIP and BARTHOLOMEW; THOMAS and MATTHEW the tax collector; JAMES the son of Alpheus, and Lebbeus whose surname is THADDEUS;

    SIMON the Canaanite and JUDAS ISCARIOT, who also betrayed Him.

    ——Matthew 10:2~4

    These 12 are the 12 disciples left in the scenario. In which, one of these 12 is the writer of the gospel we are talking about. From here we can definitely say, that the writer was among the TWELVE.

    So what can you say? Do you agree that the writer is among the 12? Please answer me before I continue.
    If not, then there’s no point of telling you the continuation.

    Thanks.

  65. Morrissey,

    All the 7 items you made are just your “PRECONCIEVED IDEAS”….

    It will remain puzzle to you if you will not consider other important things. There are probable or should I say definite reasons why John made his writings that way.

    The bible is called a “SEALED BOOK”.

    “…because no one was found worthy to open and to read the book, nor look at it” —–Revelations 5:4

    And not all who reads the bible can understand what is written in it. Most especially if you are a wicked person:

    “…And none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise will understand.” —-Daniel 12:10

    Jesus said to his disciples:
    “….To YOU it is given to know the MYSTERY of the kingdom of GOD. But to THOSE OUTSIDE, ALL THESE things are given in parables” —— Mark 4:11

    Jesus was talking to his church. He guaranteed that OUTSIDE the real congregation of God, all of the questions will remain parables and mysteries. Just like the 7 items you have made.

    Ask Bro. Eli if you really want to investigate about the truth. I hope you can find answers on those “WHYs”. Try to ask on Bro. Eli’s Bible Expositions. Hindi ka naman mapapahiya pag nagtanong ka.

    Hindi nga talaga ko dapat sumagot dito ng ganito sa’yo, kaya lang naawa ako sa’yo. Magtanong ka sa mangangaral, yun ang sinasabi sa Hagai 2:11

    “…Mangagtanong kayo ngayon sa mga saserdote ng tungkol sa kautusan….”

    Pag nagtanong ka pa, siguro konti na lang sasabihin ko, wala naman kasing programa ang Ang Dating Daan ng “ITANONG MO KAY SLOWHAND”….. ang programa po namin para sa mga taong NAGHAHANAP ng DIOS ay “ITANONG MO KAY SORIANO”. (Pwera na lang kung di ka talaga naghahanap ng Dios.)
    ————————————————————————-

    Bro. Eli,

    patawad po, di ko lang talaga matiis mga maling sinabi ni Morrissey…

  66. but you should realize that the disciples were not with jesus all the time, in fact, jesus was alone when he came to samaria, so how could JOHN have possibly recorded the conversations of jesus and the samaritan woman if he wasn’t actually there?(john 4:27). the author of john in 7:45 includes the dialogue between the “enemies” of jesus(the pharisees and the guards) regarding jesus. how could he have possibly heard and recorded their converstaion? how about the dialogue between the blind man and jesus? (john 8). JOHN didn’t actually witness these things.

    remember, the apostles fled jesus after he was arrested according to mark 14:50 and yet the author of john was able to recount the events of trial and crucifixion of jesus. how could that possibly happen?

    it’s odd that the author would include conversations that he didn’t witness and omit the events that he had witnessed like the transfiguration and the raising of jairuss daughter

    and for your info, moses didn’t write the pentateuch, it was just attributed to him by the jews and scholards since it’s impossible for moses to have recorded his own death and burial in deut 34.

  67. Morrissey,

    I am sorry, but I really pity you. You are mislead by your “Preconcieved ideas”.

    Ask one at a time Morrissey. Besides, I am not supposed to answer your questions since you didn’t answer mine based on the premises I gave. In John 6:67,

    “Then Jesus said to the TWELVE, Do you also wish to go away?” —-John 6:67

    “Then Simon Peter answered HIM, Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the Words of eternal life” —–John 6:68

    My question is, is the writer among the 12 who did not wished to go away? Yes or No? ANSWER it.
    ————————————————————————

    All of your questions were actually misleading your thoughts.

    Pagbibigyan kita sa isang tanong mo….The information of the author is enough to prove that he can record the events of the trial and the crucifixion of Jesus. Is it possible? YES it is. why? Because he was actually there. Is there a proof? YES.

    In Mark 14:50 the statement is this:
    “And leaving Him, all fled”.

    In tagalog…

    “At iniwan siya ng lahat, at NAGSITAKAS”

    But after they FLED in that scenario (of course the disciples were surprised, ikaw man yun, huhulihin ka, baka kung sayo nangyari yun baka kahit maruming pusali magsuot ka when that happened), did somebody still followed? After they fled, did somebody followed?
    The answer is a big YES.

    In John 18:15, there are 2 disciples who was recorded to followed:

    “And SIMON PETER, and another DISCIPLE followed Jesus. That DISCIPLE was known to the high priest, and HE WENT IN WITH JESUS INTO THE COURT OF THE HIGH PRIEST”

    (This DISCIPLE is the author of the gospel!)

    Can’t you still understand the verse? Now, is it not possible for the author to write the events of the trial? ANSWER me.

    Nakakaawa ka talaga…

    I only gave 2 questions… mahirap bang sagutin? Paano pa kaya kung yung mangangaral namin ang magtatanong sa’yo. I am sure malulugaw ang utak mo.

    Tumanggap ka lang ng pagkakamali kapatid, makikita mo, mauunawaan mo din yan… Aamin ka lang sa sarili mo, alam mo namang di mo nauunawaan yung sinasabi mo e. In Fact, ang dami mong tanong sa isip tungkol sa Gospel of John na di mo masagot.

    All of those questions you gave can be answered… But I will not tell you of course unless na magkapatid na tayo sa Espiritu…

    “…But to those OUTSIDE, ALL THESE things are given in PARABLES.” —–Mark 4:11

    It will remain a PARABLE to you until the end. Hanggang sa mamatay ka, mananatiling talinghaga at hiwaga sa’yo yan.
    Magsisi ka kapatid. Ang totoo, kung di ako naawa sa’yo, di naman ako magtyatyagang kausapin ka e. Ano bang pakelam ko sa’yo, e di naman tayo magkamag-anak? Di rin naman ako binabayaran dito. Pera din naman ang nawawala sa akin habang kausap kita.

    Kaya lang, natutunan namin sa loob ng Iglesia, kung paano UMIBIG at MAAWA sa kapwa. Sa tulong at awa ng Dios, at sa pamamagitan ng kapatid na Eli.

    Dati rin akong walang Dios sa buhay akala mo.

    Anyway, don’t forget to answer my questions before opening another SETS of questions ok?

    Thanks.

  68. of course he was among the TWELVE. the point is john wasn’t around jesus all the time and therefore could not possibly WITNESS everything that jesus did or said in that gospel.

    john was able to record the dialogue between the pharisees and the guard(john 7:45), the conversation between jesus and the samaritan woman(john 4:27), the blindman and jesus(john 8) yet he was not present in those scenarios.

    and where is it indicated that the “OTHER DISCIPLE” was JOHN the apostle? that’s your conclusion.

    if john was the disciple being referred to in that passage, then it means that MATTHEW was not an eye witness of the trial and execution and could not possibly narrate those events. so you have to concede that one of the GOSPEL writers, john or matthew was relying on hearsays. it’s up to you to prove that it was indeed john who was referred to in that pasage.

  69. slowhand,

    ikaw ang nagtitiyagang sumagot sa akin, cos hindi mo matanggap ng ang bible ay PURO errors, pero ang problem, hindi mo SINASAGOT, all you can say is parable, mystery and even insinuating na masama akong tao. ano pang point ng pagsagot mo kung puro pag-atake lang sa pagkatao ko ang ginagawa mo. instead of attacking me personally, why don’t you just EXPLAIN and answer them directly.

    kung talagang alam mo ang misteryo at sagot sa mga tanong na ito, hindi mo ikakailang sagutin dahil nakasalalay dito ang authencity at reliability ng bible. if you want to prove the bible, then prove it. don’t attack me dahil hindi makakatulong ito sa pagpapatunay ng bible mo.

    you said:
    “All of those questions you gave can be answered… But I will not tell you of course unless na magkapatid na tayo sa Espiritu… ”

    so hindi pala pwedeng sagutin ang mga nagtatanong na tagalabas, then why urge me to ask these things to bro ely? isn’t bro ely’s program intended to answer nonbelievers queries about the bible?

    1 peter 3:15 says
    Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,

  70. Morrissey,

    Hey,hey, wait a minute… May sinabi ba ko sa forum na ‘to na masama ka? That is your own conclusion ‘pre. Kung meron ka mang nabasa na “Wala sa masasama ang makakaunawa…” ako ba may sabi nun? Dios ang nagsabi nun kay propeta Daniel, pareho lang natin binasa.

    Parang yung verse na binigay mo sa 1 Peter 3:15. Ikaw ba may sabi niyan? Si Pedro nagsabi nyan, kaya tama yan. Hindi dahil ikaw ang nagsabi. Originally, it was Peter’s words to the members of the church.

    Regarding that verse,
    “but sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and be ready always to give an answer to everyone who asks you a reason of the hope in you, with meakness and fear”

    If I don’t have gentleness and respect, baka hinamon na kita sa kung ano dahil sa kung ano-ano ang pinagsasasabi mong mali tungkol sa pananampalataya ko. Pero hindi nga ganun e. I was surprised with the way you typed. Wala naman akong masamang sinabi. Ewan ko kung bakit ka nagrereact ng ganyan.

    Back to the topic:

    Anyways, you said: and where is it indicated that the “OTHER DISCIPLE” was JOHN the apostle? that’s your conclusion.

    Wala pa nga yung conclusion ko ‘no, nilalatag ko pa lang mga premises ko ano ka. Ang hirap sa’yo. Masyadong advance yung utak mo ng wala sa lugar.

    So you agreed that the writer was among the 12 right?
    These 12 left along with Jesus Christ. And you said you agreed that one of it is the writer.

    “Then Jesus said to the TWELVE, Do you also wish to go away?” —-John 6:67

    “Then Simon Peter answered HIM, Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the Words of eternal life” —–John 6:68

    The writer actually told us in the last part

    “This is the disciple who TESTIFIES of these things and WROTE these things. And we know that his testimony is true” — John 21:24

    So the writer of the gospel, concealed “his” identity in the so called “disciple”(John 21:24), “disciple whom Jesus love” (John 13:23, John 19:26, John 20:2, John 21:20)

    Who is this disciple? Would it be Peter? Definitely NOT. otherwise, the characters will be redundant if that happen.
    Do you know elimination method? So among the 12, who is this mysterious writer? It can’t be Simon PETER because the writer mentioned his name several times. How about the others? Definitely Judas the Iscariot is not the writer because he betrayed Christ. And his name was also mentioned in the gospel.

    So in our analysis, there are 10 left right? Is the writer of the Gospel Andrew? the brother of Simon Peter? NO! because his name was also mentioned in the Gospel
    (John 1:40, 1:44, 6:8, 12:22)

    Can it be Philip? NO. (John 1:43~48, 6:5, 6:7, 12:21~22, 14:8~9)

    How many left? There are only 8 left.

    To be continued…..

  71. Morrissey,

    Yes. Thank you.

    So, as I was saying there are only 8 left.

    Is the writer Thomas? NO. Because his name was also mentioned in John 14:5, 20:24~28, and 21:2.

    Is the writer Judas Thaddeus(Also called Lebbeus)? NO. Because his name was also mentioned in John 14:22

    Is the writer Bartholomew or Nathanael? NO. Because his name was also mentioned in John 1:45~49, John 21:2.

    Is the writer Matthew? Definetely NOT, because even his name was not mentioned, he already has his own gospel, which is the Gospel According to Matthew.

    So how many left? There are only 4 left. These 4 are:

    1.) Simon the Canaanite (He is also called Zelotes)
    2.) James (the Son of Alpheus)
    3.) James (the Son of Zebedee and brother of John)
    4.) John (the other Son of Zebedee)

    Now, let us examine, among these 4, who best suits the “disciple whom Jesus love” mentioned in the Gospel?

    One of the clues we have and we are sure is that this disciple knows how to fish. Why? because he was with the
    the other fishermen like Peter in the last part of that Gospel when they fished at the Sea of Tiberias. (John 21:1~11)

    The Apostles that are possible to be fishermen are: Simon Peter, Andrew, James and John (Matthew 4:18, 21)

    “And walking by the Sea of Galilee, Jesus saw two brothers, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea. For THEY were FISHERMEN.”

    “And going on from there, he saw another 2 brothers, James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, in a boat with Zebedee their father, mending their nets. And He called them;”

    What is my point? the writer of the gospel knows how to fish. If not, then he will not be along with the fisherman in the sea of Tiberius when Jesus revealed to them.

    To be continued….

  72. One of the characteristics of the writer, is that he knows how to fish. That is why he was in the scene when Jesus revealed in the sea of Tiberius. And in that scene, he mentioned:

    “This is the disciple who TESTIFIES of these things and WROTE these things. And we know that his testimony is true” — John 21:24

    So in here, the writer of the gospel which is among the 12 said:”this is the disciple who testifies and wrote these things.”
    And since he was with the 12 apostles he then mentioned:
    “… And WE know that HIS testimony is true.”

    Whose testimony? Is the writer talking about his own testimony or about his own personality? NO! The Author along with the other disciples (that is why he said “WE”, because he was with the 12 apostles) is telling:

    “..and WE know that HIS TESTIMONY is TRUE”

    in tagalog:

    “…at nalalaman namin ang KANYANG PATOTOO ay TOTOO”

    Kaninong PATOTOO or whose TESTIMONY is that? Let us read in John 8:13~14. Better Read it in tagalog so that it can easily be understood:

    “Sinabi nga sa kaniya ng mga Fariseo, NAGPAPATOTOO ka sa iyong sarili; HINDI TOTOO ang PATOTOO mo.”

    “Sumagot si Jesus at sa kanila’y sinabi, Bagama’t ako’y NAGPAPATOTOO sa akin din, ay TOTOO ang aking PATOTOO….”

    So as Jesus making his testimony as the Messiah (by showing great miracles and telling HIS doctrines) or “PATOTOO”, the JEWS still don’t believe HIS TESTIMONY. That is why these 12 apostles are telling us in John 21:24:

    “..and WE know that HIS TESTIMONY is TRUE”.

    Whose testimony is that? It’s the TESTIMONY of our LORD Jesus Christ.

    Is there any further PROOF that it is the testimony of Jesus Christ?
    Let us read REVELATIONS 1:9 and it says:

    “I JOHN, who also am your brother and companion in the affliction and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the Island that is called Patmos, for the Word of God and for the TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST”

    So, the writer of the gospel and the writer of the REVELATION is telling about the TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST.

    What does it mean? IT ONLY means that there is no abrupt shift from third person to first person as you have said in NUMBER 66 of this forum:
    ————————————————————————–
    the abrupt shift from third person to first person in vss. 24-25(”WE know that HIS”) indicates that the author of the epilogue, who is supposed a third-party editor, claims the preceding narrative is based on the Beloved Disciple’s testimony, while he himself is not the Beloved Disciple

    —–morrissey
    —————————————————————————-

    To be continued…

  73. Aside from these characteristics, what other things does this writer made himself unique?

    In JOHN 1:1 we can read:

    “In the beginning was the WORD, and the WORD was with GOD, and the WORD was GOD.

    in tagalog:

    “Nang pasimula siya ang VERBO, at ang VERBO ay sumasa DIOS, at ang VERBO ay Dios.”

    Who is this “WORD” or “VERBO” that the writer talking about? Let us read in verse 14 and it is said:

    “And the WORD became flesh, and tebernacled among us. And we beheld HIS glory, the glory as if the ONLY BEGOTTEN of the Father, full of grace and of truth.”

    Who is this WORD or “VERBO” which is also the ONLY BEGOTTEN of the Father? It is Jesus Christ! As a proof, we can read John 3:16:

    “For God so loved the world that He gave His ONLY-BEGOTTEN SON, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.”

    So the writer of the Gospel is teaching something. What is it? He is teaching us about the “WORD of GOD” or “Ang Verbo ng Dios” which is also Jesus Christ.

    Of all the 12 Apostles, There is none of them told this teaching except from JOHN. What is the proof? In Revelations 19:13 we can read:

    “And He had been clothed in a garment dipped in blood, and His name is called THE WORD OF GOD.”

    in tagalog:

    “At siya’y nararamtan ng damit na winisikan ng dugo: at ang kanyang pangalan ay tinatawag na ANG VERBO ng DIOS.”

    In this verse, JOHN was talking about the Christ or LAMB of God. Which is also called “THE WORD OF GOD” or “ANG VERBO NG DIOS”.

    Only JOHN used that term and statement. Now the question is, is it possible that JOHN knew something that the other Apostles did not know?

    Let us read Revelelations 10:3~4

    “And he cried with a loud voice, like a lion roaring. And when he had cried, SEVEN THUNDERS spoke their sounds.”

    “And when the SEVEN THUNDERS spoke their sounds, I WAS ABOUT TO WRITE. And I heard a voice from Heaven saying to me, SEAL UP WHAT THINGS THE SEVEN THUNDERS SPOKE, and DO NOT WRITE THESE THINGS.”

    So there is a proof, that there are things that JOHN knew something that the other Apostles did not know. One of it is the things the SEVEN THUNDERS spoke.

    Now what is my point? There is a uniqueness in the writings in the gospel of JOHN. In which we can say that there is somthing in common with the writer of the Gospel of John and the writer of the Book of Revelations. One of the examples is the teaching that Jesus Christ is the “WORD OF GOD” or “ANG VERBO NG DIOS”. Only he (JOHN) can write it. You will not read a verse from other apostles that saying “The WORD OF GOD” is the CHRIST.

    And therefore we may conclude that the writer of that Gospel is also the writer of the Book of Revelations which is APOSTLE JOHN.

    And as an answer to morrissey’s question: “How did the writer wrote the conversation of Jesus and the Samaritan”?

    If the future was revelead to John, will it be hard for Jesus to tell Him about HIS conversation with the Samaritan?

    Kung yung hinaharap, pinakita sa kanya, yun pa kayang usapan ng nakaraan ang hindi? And, hindi mahirap na ikwento ng Panginoong Hesus yung bagay na yun, since magkakasama pa sila sa lupa noon. Natural, di man nakita ni JOHN o narinig yung usapan, kung ikwento sa kanya ng Panginoon, makakatutol ba tayo? Hindi naman nagsisinungaling ang Panginoong Hesus, at di siya magsisinungaling kailan man.

    “HE who did no sin, nor was guile found in HIS mouth” —-1 Peter 2:22

    And John will never invent something because all of his writings are true. As he had said in 1 John 1:1, 3

    “That which was from the beginning, which WE HAVE HEARD, which WE HAVE SEEN with our EYES, which WE HAVE LOOKED upon, and our HANDS HAVE HANDLED concerning the WORD of life.”

    “that which we have SEEN and HEARD we declare unto you, so that you also may have fellowship with us….”

    And I say: “I hope YOU WILL HAVE A FELLOWSHIP WITH US….”

    TO GOD BE THE GLORY!
    FOREVER AND EVER!
    AMEN.

  74. “This is the disciple who TESTIFIES of these things and WROTE these things. And we know that his testimony is true” — John 21:24
    _________________________________________

    ang may patotoo sa verse na yan, yung NAGPAPATOTOO. sino ba ang nagpapatotoo??????the disciple.

    and notice the use of the word “and”(continuity).
    just because nakita mo lang na may patotoo si jesus sa john 8:13, iaaply mo na without considering the context. ang subject sa VERSE yung disipulo, hindi si jesus.

    if you interpret based only ON words,you can also interpret that the BELOVED disciple is lazarus(john 11:3,5), dahil binanggit na LOVED ni jesus si lazarus. do you accept that interpretation as well?

    slowhand said:
    Now what is my point? There is a uniqueness in the writings in the gospel of JOHN. In which we can say that there is somthing in common with the writer of the Gospel of John and the writer of the Book of Revelations.

    _____________________________________________

    why did the author of john never mentioned his name unlike the author of REVELATIONS(rev 1:9).

    slowhand said:
    And as an answer to morrissey’s question: “How did the writer wrote the conversation of Jesus and the Samaritan”?

    If the future was revelead to John, will it be hard for Jesus to tell Him about HIS conversation with the Samaritan?

    ________________________________________________

    how did john witness the dialogue between the enemies of jesus?(john 7:45)

    bakit magkakontra ang accounts sa 4 na gospels. bakit ang crucifixion sa john ay NISAN 14, sa 3 gospels NISAN 15. the crucifixion details and resurrection in JOHN also contradicted the other gospels.

  75. why john was not the beloved disciple?

    according to John 18:15
    Simon Peter and another disciple were following Jesus. Because this disciple was known to the high priest, he went with Jesus into the high priest’s courtyard,

    the “other disciple” was KNOWN to the HIGH PRIEST(annas).

    was john known to the high priest?

    Acts 4:13 informs us that the high priest didn’t know that John “had been with Jesus”. It was only then that the high priest (and those rulers) came to the conclusion that Peter and John were “unlearned and ignorant men” – and also that they “had been with Jesus”.

    In John 18:16 we read, “Peter stood at the door without. Then went out that other disciple, which was known unto the high priest, and spake unto her that kept the door, and brought in Peter“. Therefore, there is no doubt that the “other disciple” was known to the high priest. This “other disciple” could get into the palace and furthermore, he was responsible for getting Peter past the doorkeeper.

    Consequently, the Apostle John could not have been the “other disciple” because we know from Acts 4:13 that John was not known to the high priest! [Since both Annas and Caiaphas were present during the events of Acts 4, this holds up no matter which one was high priest during Jesus’ trial.]

    When Peter and John were brought before them, those Jewish rulers “took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus” (Acts 4:13). Yet this “other disciple” was publicly associated with Jesus, even before he “went in with Jesus” (in John 18:15). Besides the fact that he was “known unto the high priest”, something else said that night reveals that the “other disciple” was known to be a disciple of Jesus prior to Jesus’ trial. [But this was not true of Peter, who was later specifically asked about it!]

    In John 18:17 we see that “the damsel that kept the door” asked Peter this question: “Art not thou also one of this man’s disciples?” She used the word “also” in reference to the “other disciple”, who had just spoken with her (Jn. 18:16). Therefore, we see that even “the damsel that kept the door” knew the “other disciple” was a disciple of Jesus. However as you now know, John’s association with Jesus was not understood until Acts 4:13 occurred.

  76. Morrissey,

    Look who’s talking, your the one who interpret it based on the words. You said:

    ang may patotoo sa verse na yan, yung NAGPAPATOTOO. sino ba ang nagpapatotoo??????the disciple.

    who told you? wala ka namang basis. Likot lang ng utak mo yun kapatid. Besides, tingnan mo ha, papakita ko sa’yo kung saan ka nagkamali sa John 21:24. In John 21::24 it is said:

    “This is the disciple who testifies of these things and wrote these things. And we know that his testimony is true.”

    Is the word “AND” used as a conjuction? NO! May alam ba tayo ng kapirasong grammar? May period po yan. Sa ibang salin semicolon. That line states a new statement. Nakabasa ka lang ng “AND” continues na?Is that so?

    Confused ka kapatid. Even dun sa Acts 4:13, when you said:
    [Since both Annas and Caiaphas were present during the events of Acts 4, THIS HOLDS UP NO MATTER WHICH ONE WAS HIGH PRIEST DURING JESUS’ TRIAL.]

    Not all the HIGH Priest knew John of course. In John 18:15, only One High Priest is mentioned.

    “…. That disciple was known to the HIGH PRIEST, and he went in with Jesus into the court of the high priest.”

    It is mentioned as HIGH PRIEST not HIGH PRIESTs! Its singular, not plural.

    So, kataka-taka ba? or will you be amazed when you read in Acts na di siya nakikilala ng ibang mga dakilang saserdote? At kung kilala siya ng isa sa kanila, ipagmamayabang ba nung dakilang saserdote na yun na kilala nya yung alagad ni Kristo? Syempre Hindi! Idedeny nya rin yun dahil siya naman ang pag-iinitan nung mga kasama niyang umuusig sa Panginoon.

    Anyways, that’s enough for you. I just answered here for the benefit of the readers of this forum. And I have stated my stand.. You also have posted your stand as well. Let us let the readers decide who among us is telling the truth.

    Just continue commenting here whenever you want.
    Let us be friends.

    As the bible says:

    “But LOVE your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing in return. And your reward shall be great, and you shall be the sons of the Highest. For HE IS KIND to the unthankful and to the evil.” —–Luke 6:35

    GOD is KIND. GOD is LOVE.

  77. I won’t bother reading all the comments (as there are quite a few) to see whether what I have to say has already been said or not. So if my comments are nothing new, then oh well.

    A) Testimony/hearsay do not count as evidence in the court of the law. Please don’t say that it does. Unfortunately, the legitimacy of your entire post depends on that one particular lie of yours.

    B) The writings of Josephus (specifically the part where he mentions Jesus) have been proven to be forged. No historian around the time of the alleged Jesus Christ ever mentioned him. Not one.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s